26 years old; 740 days of abstinence

Relentless Observer

Active Member
Hello everyone.
I want to thank everyone again for being a pillar of support.
I am now essentially two years without porn.  However, I feel as though virtually no progress has been made.  There are moments where it seems I am going to recover...but, then it seems I am right back to as bad as it has ever been.
I wrote about my journey in more detail before, but for now I am just going to focus on where I am at and notable events.

One, I did do a penile doppler, which at least from a flow standpoint showed that my penile vasculature appears to be normal.  Also, my testosterone levels are within normal limits. 
Two, about a year ago I had a girlfriend and she performed oral on me a few times and each time I able to have some erection, but definitely not a full response (maybe around 60% generally).  The next sexual experience I had was about three months ago.  I met up with a girl one night and did not have any response whatsoever (my penis felt shriveled and cold).  However, the next night I managed to get up with this girl with a decent erection (usually aboout 75% maybe) and keep it up with constant stimulation.  That was a good sexual experience and she and I communicated throughout and it was enjoyable and I really didn't worry that much.  So, definitely a win.  However, since then I have not really felt anything... Since, I have made out with some girls, but generally only feel a slight swelling.

Three, I sometimes have a relatively strong morning wood, but I have only had something approaching "normal" twice in two years. Even now I only infrequently have morning wood.  My morning wood generally only lasts a few moments as I wake and is about 60% what I remember my erections being before the decline presumably due to my extensive porn habits.
Four, I have an infrequent feeling that I can have a decent response to masturbation and I suppose I just feel so desperate to feel anything that I do continue to masturbate with generally weak erections... so I tend to masturbate once a month.  I have abstained from porn for 2 years, but giving up masturbation in addition is proving extremely difficult. 

Five, I simply feel wrong.  It is never easy to focus (perhaps the brain fog that others describe, but chronic).  I feel alien.  I still find girls attractive and sexy...but, generally have no response whatsoever by sight alone, and usually only small swellings in response to making out.

All this has been extraordinarily trying on me.  I am fit, I am social, but my sexual confidence has been crushed and I don't feel human.  I realize I didn't really feel sexual the last two to three years before abstaining (the time where I very noticeably developed PIED), but rather was just addicted to porn.  Every once in a while I have a faint buzz/craving feeling to watch porn, but I am able to shake it off... its effects still linger--in the form of PIED, but I am proud at least I overcame such a major addiction in my life.
    I am extremely busy as well and have become exceedingly lonely.  I really desire a romantic relationship, but most girls seem to just want to have sex in which case I refuse for two reasons: I want an emotional connection before sex, but also am afraid I will be unable to perform) or I am unable to form emotional connections.  My extremely busy schedule helps me get distracted from this ordeal, but it also makes it difficult to ever try to meet with women, which may or may not help me if I were to form a romantic connection.

This has been a horrific trial for me.  The two and a half years before abstaining from porn I had a steady decline in arousal during my pornography viewing sessions.  Atop that have been two years of abstinence.  I have been dealing with PIED for about 5 years.  I never had sex when I was younger because I wanted emotional connections before sex and never really achieved that.  Now, I feel lost, alone, and alien.  I basically feel unlovable and like I just will not recover.

People have suggested for the past year to forego masturbation, and I will keep trying.  I don't know what else to do besides trust that continued abstinence from porn can undo all the damage porn has wrought my sexual system.
 

zander13

Active Member
Hey man if it makes you feel any better I?m closing in on 11 months and still don?t feel naturally attracted to girls. My MW is also sporadic and doesn?t last that long. I can?t imagine 2 years of this, so I greatly admire your dedication. I guess all you and I can do is keep going. You?re kind of inspiration, just saying.
 

mousemat1

Well-Known Member
I admire you decision to avoid casual sex and your decision to wait until you find a girl you can connect with emotionally.

You're in a difficult position. You don't want to have sex in case you don't get a normal erection, but perhaps you need to be rewiring to the real thing. It's very difficult to know for certain.

I have a partner and I just don't feel sexual towards her. In fact, I feel a little repulsed when she tries to kiss me. I've rebooted before and know that this will pass, but I also know that at some point I'm going to have to try and be intimate with her, simply to start the rewiring process. I understand how stressful it is when you feel no real desire to be with women because of PIED.

Avoiding porn for two years is a real achievement, so I congratulate you on that.
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
Zander13, mousemat1,
Thank you for your words.
It is a tough place to be in life and letting it out on this site and sharing makes it a bit more bearable.
I am very much looking forward to the day I can post my success story on this site.  Maybe it will be another year from now... but, regardless the amount of time I am committed to recovery.

With regards to rewiring... I essentially have come to the point where I simply want to form sexual connections with women, but my continued struggles with PIED really make it tough to want to pursue it.  Ideally I will find a woman who cares about me... and we can laugh it off if I fail a few times... I don't doubt there is a mental component of anxiety at this point.  It wasn't there when I started... i assumed I would recover in a few weeks or months max... but, now I do feel shame and anxiety with girls if I have been flirting with one for a while and don't feel anything or make out with a girl and only feel about a half-erection. 
However, I have taken the leap a few times now with girls I trust and it worked out well enough.

I will keep going and i look forward to reading more and more success stories in these forums.
 
Wow, love your dedication man. You will be alright in no time. And yes, an emotional connection seems to help a lot in this case as you look forward to being with someone special and not just PMOing.

This community by far is the best and most positive place I've come across. May we all reach your level of abstinence. It is a crazy success story in itself !
 

Fappy

Respected Member
thats very impressive! escpecially for someone of your young age to voluntarily abstain from casual sex. but its exactly as you said, wait until you have an emitional connection with someone, that will make all the difference. Just shoving it up any piece of casual arse you find on the street might serve only to get your rocks off, but it will have damaging effects. trust me. im not only referring to some dirty STIs you could pick up from her, but the efficiency and speed of your recovery process will be in jepardy!
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
Thanks guys for the encouragement.  I appreciate the words about trying to find an emotional connection too.
Out of curiosity, Fappy, I am interested why you think casual sex would not be helpful for recovery.  I am not totally against casual sex, but I personally feel that having an emotional connection would be ideal.
 

quitforeverthenwin2

Well-Known Member
Sorry to hear you are struggling. Wow way to go on 700 days plus.

The solution is simple though: Rewiring. I found it made little difference if I was two weeks porn free or many months. The first time with a girl my erection was awful and it just gets better and better each time I cuddle kiss etc without cumming.

Simple as that. So what you need is a rewire partner. If you cuddle/kiss a girl several times a week your erections will get better and better then you can escalate into sex without cumming.

This is the part some of us miss rewiring is CRUCIAL, the erections simply don't just come back by abstaining, rewiring is necessary.

My source is rewiring several times.

This last time I had months clean, got almost no erection first time cuddle girl, then a bit more the second time by the 5th or 6th time really good erections. The time frame varies but rewiring is key and it takes repetition.

Maybe finding a religous/ in experienced girl who'd want to do such a thing, lots of kissing/ cuddling without sex for a time.

Tinder/apps for me is too triggering but if it weren't I'd put a profile and playfully put "looking for a cuddle buddy", I have seen girls put that it may take going through a lot of girls but I think it could work, with a good profile to get an actual cuddle buddy.

Best of luck man. You're on the right track, one way or another you will rewire
 

Guts

Member
What's the longest you've gone without masturbation and orgasm Relentless Observer?
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
quitforeverthenwin2, thank you for the emphasizing the rewiring partner.  I have tried to get a good relationship throughout this ordeal... but, I really am having issues with girls.  Perhaps I do need to use some sort of dating app -- I really like the cuddle buddy suggestion.  It would not surprise me that rewiring with a woman would speed up my recovery / make my recovery more apparent to me.

Guts,
I went my first 84 days without masturbation.  Since then I have had several streaks between 20 and 60 days.  I have had some periods where I simply give in and masturbate a few days in a row.  Now, it has been about 2 weeks without M.  Also, I have only been able to masturbate to touch alone maybe 4 times during this period... usually I do fantasize about girls in my life and I focus on trying to make it "real," but I suppose I have very limited sexual experience and it may not be very realistic fantasy.
I used to fantasize a ton throughout this reboot... a ways back I  cut out fantasy as much as possible from my reboot with the most notable exception being during my masturbation.
 

Fappy

Respected Member
Relentless Observer said:
Thanks guys for the encouragement.  I appreciate the words about trying to find an emotional connection too.
Out of curiosity, Fappy, I am interested why you think casual sex would not be helpful for recovery.  I am not totally against casual sex, but I personally feel that having an emotional connection would be ideal.
Hi,
By casual sex i took you to mean just picking up any old girl and having sex, just for the sake of having sex. i do agree that intercourse can help the recovery process, but i gathered from your post that you wanted to wait until there was a concrete emotional connection to the person you are boning. if not, then just make sure shes clean!
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
Fappy,
Thanks!  I will keep thinking about this; it is tough because often I feel I just cannot connect with women and I wonder if just "hooking up" would be good for me and for my recovery... but I am hesitant on that and with my PIED I feel afraid atop it to casually hook up with someone.

In general:
I want to share too that a couple months ago I was in a good mindset...I was able to feel better about who I am for the sake of being who I am...but a lot of things are going on lately... mostly the past two month (after largely staying at home) starting to socialize again set off the bad mindset because I feel so separated from people.  My PIED makes me feel alien, and atop that I have never connected well with girls. 
I am of a mindset that I always reflect on things and try to do things better next time... and some people tell me "I think too much."  Perhaps this is true, and I somehow just need to relax...but, it is more difficult than ever when I feel something is profoundly wrong with me.
I feel for everyone going through this process and I hope to find a way to treat myself better.

One more thing...I feel that I am addicted to youtube...I am super busy and when I have a break that is how I spend a lot of my time... and often time I should set aside for sleep.  Often it is music on car rides or something...it feels that I have to be constantly stimulated.
So, I decided I will cut out music on my commute.  I did it this morning and it was interesting.  I can't say for sure, but perhaps that is why today I felt a profound exhaustion when I got home today.  I had to lie down and do nothing today.  If I am dependent/addicted to constant stimulation then perhaps this is a withdrawal of sorts... if this seems to continue/affect me in any way I shall update this journal.

Thanks everyone for the encouragement and well wishes.
 

quitforeverthenwin2

Well-Known Member
Oh, I didn't realize you'd been masturbating. I thought you meant 700+ days porn and masturbation free.

Those are two really different things. I'd cut the masturbation as well at least for a long time. If you are masturbating every few weeks and intermittently rewiring there is no reason to think you would recover imo.

The rewiring is crucial for sure. But masturbating with fantasy (especially if it is porn influenced) for sure could mess with erections (it does with me at least).

I was having issues fantasizing about porn and even that messes with my erections.... Like even when rewired/rewiring fantasizing about porn without touching my penis sets my erections back a good amount.

So there is a lot you could be doing
#1 Stop masturbating
#2 Work on getting the rewire partner
#3 Cut out fantasizing/ at least porn inspired fantasy.

So this is kind of bitter sweet good news in a way imo....
Bittersweet in that you are not as abstinent as you thought (still good job on cutting out porn, looks like you've done that permanently, just stay that way)
But you've never done a full 90+ days maturbation free or a full hard mode type rewire. But the sweet part is:
You are nowhere near as hopeless or have any reason to be as you thought in your first post. You aren't continuing to have erection problems because you have some innate problem you are having them because there are stones left unturned you gotta handle to fix it.

It's better to be honest with ourselves. I had sex this morning and my erection was so-so but instead of saying "omg it's not fair I have done everything" it is better to be honest..... I fantasized about porn two days ago, it takes like 5 days for my erections to recover from that. So there is more I can do to have better erections.
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
quitforeverthenwin2 said:
Oh, I didn't realize you'd been masturbating. I thought you meant 700+ days porn and masturbation free.

Those are two really different things. I'd cut the masturbation as well at least for a long time. If you are masturbating every few weeks and intermittently rewiring there is no reason to think you would recover imo.

The rewiring is crucial for sure. But masturbating with fantasy (especially if it is porn influenced) for sure could mess with erections (it does with me at least).

I was having issues fantasizing about porn and even that messes with my erections.... Like even when rewired/rewiring fantasizing about porn without touching my penis sets my erections back a good amount.

So there is a lot you could be doing
#1 Stop masturbating
#2 Work on getting the rewire partner
#3 Cut out fantasizing/ at least porn inspired fantasy.

So this is kind of bitter sweet good news in a way imo....
Bittersweet in that you are not as abstinent as you thought (still good job on cutting out porn, looks like you've done that permanently, just stay that way)
But you've never done a full 90+ days maturbation free or a full hard mode type rewire. But the sweet part is:
You are nowhere near as hopeless or have any reason to be as you thought in your first post. You aren't continuing to have erection problems because you have some innate problem you are having them because there are stones left unturned you gotta handle to fix it.

It's better to be honest with ourselves. I had sex this morning and my erection was so-so but instead of saying "omg it's not fair I have done everything" it is better to be honest..... I fantasized about porn two days ago, it takes like 5 days for my erections to recover from that. So there is more I can do to have better erections.

Thank you for the thoughtful response.
I have started abstaining from masturbating since the start of the month and will continue from here.  It is tough.  I never fantasize about past porn I watch and when I have fantasized I always tried to make it with people I personally know and make it realistic, but perhaps that just cannot happen.
I do recall one instance of a particularly intense fantasy after which my penis went completely lifeless for days...and after that I have cut out fantasy more (except for with my intermittent masturbation).  So, I agree any fantasy can probably hinder my progress in some way.
I really want to fully embrace the attitude of only getting sexual satisfaction with a real woman...but, I continue to falter.  Partially because of fear.  I fear I will not recover, which makes me feel unlovable.  I continue to falter, partially due to it seeming like no girl wants to be with me... I have pursued many relationships these past two years and despite being fit and trying to act intentionally I cannot seem to find any girl who wants to be with me. 
I have wanted a deep connection for such a long time...coupled with this trial I really am struggling.  I want a rewiring partner, and even more so a loving partner.  However, I just can't seem to find anyone and that depresses me.  I know there has to be so many people who would like to be with me if I could find them in the right times, but I don't know how to find anyone apparently.  I admit I get envious of people on here who seem to get rewiring partners easily.  I know it isn't easy for everyone, and it certainly isn't easy for me.

I don't like to express self-pity, but I have been feeling this way for a while and I needed to get it out that I feel sorry for myself.
I am determined to get back in a better mindset and believe that no P no M no O is the way to go and that I will recover from this and I am worth loving.
 

quitforeverthenwin2

Well-Known Member
Yeah man. I think a big part of this is delayed gratification....

It is hard to give up MO because you are not certain you can get a real partner, but to get that partner you probably have to give up MO.

Try and think longer term. We can repeatedly try and get a partner this month or this week and be really discouraged when it doesn't work....

I was in that spot for a few years.... Just very sporadic spats with girls here and there. I think I had crappy sex a few years ago, then a few things here and there, but full years in between more or less...

Anyways. What is necessary is to think longer term. Feeling like we can never get a girl, then trying to get a girl now and it not working leads to misery. The long term view is more like "Okay if I keep doing the right things in 6 months to a year I will have a girl.

It seems like a long term but imagine if you'd done that 740 days ago? So think to a year from now, you could have a girlfriend, great erections and a good sex life and this moment won't seem too long ago.

Plus you are hooking up with girls. You had a girlfriend a year ago, sexual expeience 3 months ago, made out with some girls. That is more then the average guy....

I think keeping the girls is prob the important part, cutting out masturbation will help so your dick works. Also try adding in some things you enjoy to your life so you don't feel as desperate. For me I was really focused on work and meeting girls for awhile and I started feeling awful, then I realized I wasn't doing anything "just for fun" to nourish myself and I have now started reading novels again and hung out with a friend it really helped.

Finally if it really is hard for you to meet women, it is a skill that you can improve upon. It's not all about intention
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
quit,
Thank you for your response.
I think I have certainly got into a bad mindset the past while.  I am focused on getting back into a better mindset.
I shall keep updating.
It has been nearly two weeks now for complete noPMO.
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
An update:
about two weeks without masturbation now and I am starting to get much more temptations toward it.  I shall stay strong though and will not masturbate.

I figure, I may as well get on a few dating apps to try to expand my social field a bit a few days ago...
it makes me anxious and some of the revealing photos girls have in their profiles makes me a bit uncomfortable, but i have had no temptation to go to porn... and I have had a few matches so far.
Texting/messaging always stresses me out (I always prefer in-person stuff), but just having any new connections is sorta exciting too.
I'm gonna have one of my female friends critique my profiles too.  Maybe over the next few months I can connect with some women and form a good relationship outside the app.

Regardless: my two major foci now are to be noPMO and to put myself out there more in the social fields to try to have a solid relationship.

Thanks everyone for your support.
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
I am here to talk about an experience with a dating app.
I have had a good past few days.  I got on some dating apps a week ago, and today I was shocked as one profile was soliciting prostitution and pornographic.  This is the first blatant display I have seen, but it took me by surprise.  I covered the screen with my hand to block the view and mark the person as a no go.
- I was worried how I would react...but, I feel strong despite seeing such an image and will remain abstinent.  I don't count it as a break of hardmode as I didn't search it...but, for those considering getting on dating apps, just be aware that you may see more than you expect.

Good luck everyone!
 

Jeks

Well-Known Member
hey man,

i did not read your whole thread yet. Still i wanted to tell you, that you are not alone with your struggles. I am now 14 months without porn without major breakthroughs. What i wonder, can you remember, if your first time masturbating was with porn?
I have a suspicion that guys, which masturbated the first time with porn and maybe never or very rarely did it without have the toughest and longest path. I have a feeling that this often is what differentiates guys like us and the generation of gabe deem, noah church, because we were ableto use internet porn in the youngest age.

From what i have heard, renouncing masturbation often times seems to initiate more progress with long time rebooters. I even head gary wilson saying something like this, even though he often times seemed a little unsure about this topic. Unfortunatley i cant find the source. But he said something like, for a few guys stopping masturbation really seems to be a necessary step to get progress.

I am sure you will make it out of it. We will find a way.
 

Relentless Observer

Active Member
Jeks said:
hey man,

i did not read your whole thread yet. Still i wanted to tell you, that you are not alone with your struggles. I am now 14 months without porn without major breakthroughs. What i wonder, can you remember, if your first time masturbating was with porn?
I have a suspicion that guys, which masturbated the first time with porn and maybe never or very rarely did it without have the toughest and longest path. I have a feeling that this often is what differentiates guys like us and the generation of gabe deem, noah church, because we were ableto use internet porn in the youngest age.

From what i have heard, renouncing masturbation often times seems to initiate more progress with long time rebooters. I even head gary wilson saying something like this, even though he often times seemed a little unsure about this topic. Unfortunatley i cant find the source. But he said something like, for a few guys stopping masturbation really seems to be a necessary step to get progress.

I am sure you will make it out of it. We will find a way.

Jeks,
That is an interesting observation.
My first sexual memories were some of my youngest memories...just a general sense I wanted to see women naked.  However, I think the first time I ever masturbated was to a porn picture.  I had already started watching some porn videos at this time, but I hadn't started masturbating until that moment...then, I started to masturbate more and more.  I did not use porn all the time, but I ALWAYS fantasized.  I don't think it was always "porn fantasy," but I NEVER masturbated to touch alone.  As I grew older I would essentially only masturbate with porn.  I did that very often for many years.
As you stated, this may be a common thread, that really long rebooters have even their first masturbation experiences coupled with pornography.
 
Top