Starting a new diary

Aussie_85

Active Member
cool, I like some of those genres.

I can relate to the lack of emotions and love - particularly with anti depressant medications. In a really weird way i kind of enjoyed it...and that sounds kind of messed up. Instead of the crippling anxiety and depression - I felt nothing. It allowed me to function, work, do whatever social shit i had to - not really enjoying it, nor hating it - just kind of going from one day to the next not really caring about anything.

For me it reached a point where that was making me depressed though, and I came off meds. I was significantly better though because the meds are supposed to correct chemical imbalances even after stopping them.

Everyone's different man but listen to your body - and go to a doc/shrink if your unsure or notice any big changes in moods.

It's really cool that you've played some gigs, I've always wanted to learn how to mix vinyl, I'd never want to play gigs though - just as a hobby.

Can i ask what state you live in man? I'm NSW.
 

SebUK

Active Member
Kid: Yeah that's the docu haha... I will have to watch that Norton interview now. Love Arnie! Such a legend.

I'm pretty sure if I could get free of this addiction for six months plus, my feelings about things would start changing dramatically, with or without the SSRIs. I reckon after my last three months cycle, where I was feeling really good, I was probably still in the 'hole' relatively speaking compared to my pre-addiction feelings and moods. But it's been so long since I felt that way that just to not feel like complete shit feels amazing.

Aussie: Yeah man...the SSRIs definitely help me function too. Only problem is I reckon they prevent me from dealing with some of the shit I need to deal with. Like extreme anger/hatred/despair, which starts to come back when I go off them. Not sure what to do about that. I guess I will just go for six months and if I make it, then consider tapering them off.

I'm in Victoria :D

Main thing for me to note today is that I drank three pints of beer last night and when I came home, the desire to look at porn kept popping into my thoughts. It wasn't super strong so I managed to get through it, which is pretty awesome given that I'm on holiday and this is uber high risk time for me to relapse. As the alcohol wore off, the thoughts slowly started weakening and I was able to dismiss them more easily. Also Maccas helped...no joke. When I'm hungry and drunk, that is an even more risky situation for relapsing. Thanks Maccas!

Another thing that helped was that I'm going out on Saturday night and I don't want to be all depressed and worse, cancel going out. So ensuring I have stuff organised is very important.

Still sticking to my routine and slowly cranking it up with more things to do each day. This is working well so far.

NB: I'm still MOing every few days. Interestingly, I don't get the chaser effect like I do if I PMO. I'm certain that PMO is activating a different mechanism/reward thing in my brain compared to just MO. The one which blasts my brain with dopamine, probably.

Hope everyone has a good weekend :)

 

SebUK

Active Member
Fairly uneventful day again so far for me. Basically filling this entry out a bit earlier than normal because I'm heading out tonight and am likely to drink and want to make sure that I have written down here that I do NOT want to relapse after I come home. If I write it down, it should be less likely.

The main reason I drink in the first place is social anxiety and to relax, and yet the porn increases my social anxiety! Vicious cycle.

Having said that, even before this addiction, I used to drink to reduce anxiety. So I can't put it all down to porn. Just mostly...lol.

Otherwise weekend is going well. Do need to find some more exciting activities to do though.
 

SebUK

Active Member
So got through the weekend with no PMO. Woop! Drank way too much on Saturday as well so was hungover as hell all Sunday and even part of Monday. Even though I was super drunk I was still alert enough to invite a friend over who slept on my couch. I'm pretty sure I did this subconsciously (or consciously even) in order to prevent a relapse. Good stuff!

The thing about alcohol is it is a complete waste of money! I spent over $200! Ahhhh! I got about $50 of value I'd say. Should have spent that money on music equipment and just gone out sober. I really need to learn how to socialise in a club or bar without alcohol.

More interestingly, it's very obvious to me now that alcohol is a self-soothing mechanism that has a lot of similarities to porn. I use alcohol to self-sooth in social situations, like most people. Calm the anxiety etc. Porn is not that dissimilar. I use it to self-sooth when I'm feeling bored or tired or in need of a pep/excitement. These maladaptive behaviours we have developed over time, argh. The annoying thing is I think they're much harder to change the longer you use. Kind of like Frodo's ring in LOTR (yes I've been watching a lot of LOTR haha). The more he uses it, the more damage it does.

I'm still sticking to my routine. I go through my daily list and tick things off and get a small hit of dopamine for every bell sound :p Yeah it's not quite the same as a dopamine hit from new porn images, but it's better than nothing and it seems to be working so far.

The fact I'm not working is probably also helping. Basically I'm not stressed at all when I go to bed. This is good!


 

TheHeartacheKid

Active Member
Nice man!  Sounds like things are going well.

I also used to self soothe will alcohol as well.  Actually, once I got that under control earlier this year, P kind of took off for me, which means I was just replacing alcohol with P.  So be cautious of that (not saying you'll replace P with alcohol, just something to be alert of).

But again, things sound like they're heading in a positive direction for you.  So keep it up!  Very happy for you!
 

SebUK

Active Member
Thanks mate! Yep almost four weeks now. Today was another pretty good day. My sleeping patterns are completely screwed. I went to bed at 6am :D And woke up at 12 and finally got out of bed at 1pm. Now this sounds very lazy, and I guess in a way it is, but for the rest of the day I had good energy and got a lot done (and no naps). I wonder if I'm slightly vampirish... as I seem to operate better with this weirdo sleep pattern.

My energy in general is starting to increase and I will mostly put that down to not relapsing. Anxiety also still decreasing after a plateau for a while.

So all in all pretty happy. I think I'm through the dark cycle that happens after every relapse. Now to stay on the wagon!

What will be interesting is whether the urges come back. At the moment they are very weak and easy to dispel. Since I'm not working, and since working is quite a big trigger (I think), I reckon I might be able to go for quite a while without any urges.

If so, this does not bode well for my job/career!
 

Aussie_85

Active Member
hey man insomnia/sleeping issues are the worst part of rebooting for me - it can get super hard if it ends up going on for weeks/months with shitty sleep. And nothing helps me, Valium, Temazepam, Weed, Restavit...nothing works - wired all night and wrecked all day - nightmare.

Sounds like your going well though mate, keep it up!

Aussie.
 

SebUK

Active Member
Yeah man I don't know if it's the reboot or the SSRIs or both even, or just my genetics!!

I'm happy to report that I've 'fixed' my patterns and am now waking up at 5.30am and going to bed at 10pm. I STILL need a nap during the day which is annoying. Again not sure what is causing this - I didn't use to do this when I was younger. Maybe I'm just getting old? (But don't old people sleep less?).

Pretty uneventful otherwise. Still keeping on with the music and generally sticking to the structure, although yesterday was a bit of a blow out.

A girl is coming over tonight, so that will be 'interesting'. I am aiming to get laid and presume she is but if not, I'm okay with that. But if she is keen, then that should also be good :D Just need to be careful with how it impacts on my reboot. As I've said in other posts, in my brain at least, PMO and MO/sex are separate for me. Possibly connected, but definitely separate. So I'm not too worried about relapsing just because I have sex, it doesn't seem to work that way in my case.

Otherwise everything else is going fine.

Hope everyone is doing well!
 

SebUK

Active Member
Yeah well, having a clean conscience definitely helps me get to sleep more easily!

Chick ended up bailing :( Part of me was happy though, I was a bit anxious about it. Afterwards I felt way more relaxed.

Since then I've been watching a show called Love, a Judd Apatow produced show. It's really good and has this girl in it who I'm completely obsessed with (Gillian Jacobs). Not in a creepy unhealthy way (maybe a little unhealthy) but I just can't stop thinking about her. I keep trying to figure out why and have now become obsessed with trying to understand why. Yes she is pretty but I think it's something more.

There was a girl I knew back in 2012 who was the cool hipster girl at work. She had one of those personalities where everyone was kind of drawn to her and she always had friends. She projected this image of someone who kind of sailed through life (her parents were fairly well off). She wasn't doing this intentionally - it was just something that you became aware of if you were near her. I know her life probably wasn't as idealistic as I've made it out to be in my mind but there was something so magnetic about her and her life and I really wanted to be a part of it. I haven't spoken or seen her for years now but I just can't stop thinking about her.

Anyway, Gillian Jacobs reminds me SO much of her. The cool hipster pretty girl.

I have no idea why I keep thinking about her/the other girl.

Maybe it is because I always wanted to be the cool guy with the pretty girlfriend? But I didn't... and I don't. At least not consciously.

A lot of this shit relates to my addiction to porn, which is why I'm typing it out here. Everyone thinks I'm a nice guy IRL, especially women. But I have this latent resentment. It has mostly gone now, but it was the source of a lot of porn binges. I.e. come home from a club alone (due to lack of game) and feel angry and resentful and look at porn.

I think the addiction is now independent of why it started, but the why still fascinates me.

And the why obviously still has some impact because for the last couple of weeks I've become obsessed with Gillian Jacobs! (and the hipster girl I actually knew haha).

Also, I'm pretty sure this is part of my relapse cycle. I relapse, and then I start to feel better and normal and my confidence starts returning. Then I start thinking about relationships. At first this is great, it feels normal and healthy. But then... it turns to sadness? And despair again? And longing? I don't know.

I really need to start doing some shit and stop thinking so much about the past and fantasising.

Just do it etc.

I'm 38, still got time.

What a rambling post! Hope everyone is doing alright out there :)
 
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escapeandnevercomeback

Guest
Definitely, man. I believe porn addiction makes us more obsessed about girls and sex. Maybe not everybody? But it makes me, that's for sure, and I might not be the only one. Our genes make us search for girls but what porn does is remind you there is so much sex out there and you are not part of it (if your situation is a guy who has a sexless life at this moment) or that you are shit because you don't have the pick up skills (some type of porn creates this fantasy where the guy meets the girl and they start fuckin in 2 minutes "When am I able to do the same?" And this is where this creeps in your mind and rearranges your thoughts). Porn made me feel like I'm missing out the most important thing and that everything else in life is absolutely 0 if I can't fuck. I became obsessed about it and it messed up my mind to the point where I start questioning my desire and libido, being afraid that I will be extremely horny even after I quit porn, which sometimes I think it's not true.
 

TheHeartacheKid

Active Member
SebNZ said:
Yeah well, having a clean conscience definitely helps me get to sleep more easily!

Chick ended up bailing :( Part of me was happy though, I was a bit anxious about it. Afterwards I felt way more relaxed.

Since then I've been watching a show called Love, a Judd Apatow produced show. It's really good and has this girl in it who I'm completely obsessed with (Gillian Jacobs). Not in a creepy unhealthy way (maybe a little unhealthy) but I just can't stop thinking about her. I keep trying to figure out why and have now become obsessed with trying to understand why. Yes she is pretty but I think it's something more.

There was a girl I knew back in 2012 who was the cool hipster girl at work. She had one of those personalities where everyone was kind of drawn to her and she always had friends. She projected this image of someone who kind of sailed through life (her parents were fairly well off). She wasn't doing this intentionally - it was just something that you became aware of if you were near her. I know her life probably wasn't as idealistic as I've made it out to be in my mind but there was something so magnetic about her and her life and I really wanted to be a part of it. I haven't spoken or seen her for years now but I just can't stop thinking about her.

Anyway, Gillian Jacobs reminds me SO much of her. The cool hipster pretty girl.

I have no idea why I keep thinking about her/the other girl.

Maybe it is because I always wanted to be the cool guy with the pretty girlfriend? But I didn't... and I don't. At least not consciously.

A lot of this shit relates to my addiction to porn, which is why I'm typing it out here. Everyone thinks I'm a nice guy IRL, especially women. But I have this latent resentment. It has mostly gone now, but it was the source of a lot of porn binges. I.e. come home from a club alone (due to lack of game) and feel angry and resentful and look at porn.

I think the addiction is now independent of why it started, but the why still fascinates me.

And the why obviously still has some impact because for the last couple of weeks I've become obsessed with Gillian Jacobs! (and the hipster girl I actually knew haha).

Also, I'm pretty sure this is part of my relapse cycle. I relapse, and then I start to feel better and normal and my confidence starts returning. Then I start thinking about relationships. At first this is great, it feels normal and healthy. But then... it turns to sadness? And despair again? And longing? I don't know.

I really need to start doing some shit and stop thinking so much about the past and fantasising.

Just do it etc.

I'm 38, still got time.

What a rambling post! Hope everyone is doing alright out there :)

Sorry the woman bailed, but very glad to hear you're doing okay with it.  What you describe about going home alone because of a "lack of game" resonated so much with me.  I actually wondered if you stole my thoughts for a minute :p.  That's exactly what it was for me though, especially what you describe with that girl from your past.  I constantly fantasize about women (not even sexually, just being with them) and then that's all I have, the fantasy.  So I turn to P.  It is 100% resentment.  For me it's resentment for myself.  Like I'm too pathetic to actually find a real woman (or even talk to one) so I just indulge in P because why not?  It's all I can do.  Bad way of thinking and it leads to addiction.  I don't know if you feel similarly to that, but sounds like maybe in some way you do...then again I could be way off :p.

The feeling good and having confidence, and then you start to think about actually having a relationship and it goes to shit? Yep, same exact thing for me.  And it's just a way for our brain to make us doubt ourselves and indulge in the addiction.

So much of what you said there hits home to me.  We can beat it though.  And you've got this down man, you're making good decisions all over the place and I can tell from just your posts you're feeling better and making progress mentally.  Keep it up my friend.
 

Aussie_85

Active Member
dude, honestly dont underestimate your last post - it's oozing with insight into yourself and your addiction, this is great.

Your trigger (one of them) is after the initial starting phase of a reboot, you start feeling lonely - thinking about women, relationships - past failures - it all bubbles away until one day you decide fuck it and relapse. Really think about this, prepare for it - so when it next occurs, remember "your trying to trick me again, I'm not using because of this again"

Or you'll struggle with it for the rest of your life.

Bro i have a story for you, sorry for high jacking your journal but it may resonate a bit:

tl;dr = Met a chick, she had the biggest crush on me - i turned her down, she was my quintessential dream girl, am now obsessed about said girl.

I met her at TAFE way back when i was around 18, so 17 years ago approx. (wow, that went quick)
At the time, i was with my current GF - we split a few years later then reconnected 5 years ago - this chick was a 10 bro no shit, gorgeous. Smart, sexy, fun we got along like a house on fire - she admitted she had a huge crush on me, it was like overly obvious - she wanted me bad - this is literally the perfect chick (for me) she bought in her modelling portfolio to TAFE for me to look at, jesus. nuff said. I turned her every advance down, the TAFE course ended.

A year or so later, after randomly talking on MSN messenger she came over to one of my mates places for a party - the first time I'd seen her outside of TAFE. We had a good night, she met some of my friends - as the night drew to a close she came and sat on my lap, and basically mouth raped me. I was trashed, prob went for a minute, then i stopped and said i can't, i have a missus.

My mate fucked her that night, then was with her for around 12 months, the entire time was awkward as fuck, because she still secretly wanted me - it was obvious. I even lived with them sharing a 2 bedroom apartment for a few months, we were good friends - but i could tell any time i wanted to I could've had her.

Fast forward again - I've broken up with my gf, and her with my mate - some time has passed, we text. I'm in the midst of the worst few years of my addiction - my only motivation in life was to PMO, i was unemployed with no car in my mid twenties lonely depressed and anxious as fuck masturbating my life away. She rings me, says she misses me - she wants to come and pick me up in her car, i say no i cant - I'm "busy". That was the last time i spoke to her - she's still a 10 - and i secretly still regret it and think about her very often. I used to masturbate over her, hundreds of times - her facey/insta pics etc fantasizing about being with her.

So basically I think there's a huge correlation between missing out on, straight up turning down opportunities with women because of porn - then regretting it, and manifesting obsessions over the one/ones who got away. I believe i would've long forgotten about the TAFE chick, had i not been a porn addict, that shit happens to people all the time - I'm not special.

Man if my missus read this she would be devastated, she knows her - and knew how much she liked me - i still honestly wish I'd given it a go, we got along so well. and that makes me feel guilty because i really love my gf now, deeply.


Aussie.


 

SebUK

Active Member
Thanks for the replies dudes!

@escape: 100% agree... porn definitely makes me feel like I'm missing out and resentful. Interestingly I hate the fake 'pro' stuff, probably because there's nothing I can 'learn' from it. Learn as in, oh that guy is really good in bed and has a hot girl - how can I learn from him? Fucked up but that could be part of my mentality. Anyway, now that I've been off porn for over a month I don't have that missing out feeling anymore, just a kind of hole inside, which I now think is what I was talking about in my post above.

@heartachekid: Yeah man I can definitely relate to that! "The feeling good and having confidence, and then you start to think about actually having a relationship and it goes to shit? Yep, same exact thing for me.  And it's just a way for our brain to make us doubt ourselves and indulge in the addiction." this... although I think it's actually broader than having a relationship maybe. Like just dealing with life in general (with confidence). It's easier to just say "fuck it" and go back to the porn-relapse cycle and self-pity etc. Then I don't have to change. Even though it feels shit being in this cycle, it is so comfortable now and 'normal' in a way.

@aussie: you wrote "Your trigger (one of them) is after the initial starting phase of a reboot, you start feeling lonely - thinking about women, relationships - past failures - it all bubbles away until one day you decide fuck it and relapse." yeah this is pretty much spot on. The SSRI's dull the lonely feeling a bit so it doesn't really feel like anything before I relapse. I think this is called 'anhedonia'. But if I wasn't on SSRI's I reckon I'd be feeling pretty bad. Anyway, outcome is the same: relapse.

I wonder if your story is worse than mine given that you could actually get that girl and I'm pretty sure the one I'm talking about was never keen on me...hahah! Girls man. Fucked up thing is I actually like being single. The thought of a relationship makes me cringe. I have been married and it was okay but I like being single WAY more. I really can't see myself being in a long term relationship. I even once tried to imagine being with Gillian Jacobs and I couldn't even imagine that LOL. Like it would be cool at first, but then once it loses its wow, you're just left with the same crappy relationship stuff. Like having to go to couples dinners (puke), all the domestic bullshit. Each to their own re: kids, but I don't want them.

Maybe your story is a good reason for not living longer than 100 years - imagine all the resentfulness, sadness and lost opportunities we'd have to dwell on if we just went on and on and on?

Actually I think the worst form of torture possible would be to make someone live forever. Imagine if you could not die - that would literally be hell. Really, think about it. Even if you are happy, living for 10,000 years? And then another 100,000 years?

Have you guys seen that show True Detective? I relate a lot to Rust Cohle's philosophy, haha. I like this quote, a bit of a long one:

" I'd consider myself a realist, alright? But in philosophical terms I'm what's called a pessimist... I think human consciousness is a tragic misstep in evolution. We became too self-aware. Nature created an aspect of nature separate from itself - we are creatures that should not exist by natural law... We are things that labor under the illusion of having a self, that accretion of sensory experience and feelings, programmed with total assurance that we are each somebody, when in fact everybody's nobody... I think the honorable thing for our species to do is to deny our programming. Stop reproducing, walk hand in hand into extinction - one last midnight, brothers and sisters opting out of a raw deal."

Anyway, I'm not suicidal or anything, just a bit sad today. Which actually feels quite nice. To feel something.


 

SebUK

Active Member
Just checking in. Pretty uneventful day. I'm sleeping a helluva lot at the moment, which kind of sucks. Although it's because my sleeping patterns are completely screwed. For example, last night I went to bed at 7am and woke up at 12. I did a few things then had another sleep from 5 - 7pm. I'm basically Leonardo Da Vinci at this point! I will try to stay awake all night and correct my sleeping patterns. Thing is, I quite like being awake all night! No, I am not part vampire, I just have more energy at night for some reason. This even applies when my sleeping patterns are 'correct'. For example, if I stay awake all night tonight, and then go to bed at a normal time like 11pm and wake up at 8am - I'll end up napping throughout the day and having less energy throughout the day too! I have no idea why but it's annoying as hell.

I've decided to start weening myself off the SSRI's. I think they are destroying my energy. I'm willing to feel more sadness and emotion if it boosts my energy. Now is the time to deal with those emotions now that I have some time off. Actually that is one of the reasons I took this time off in the first place. I'm just a bit worried that if I come off the SSRIs and then relapse, I then have to spend the rest of my break recovering from that relapse and I'll end up going to work feeling a bit shit.
 

TheHeartacheKid

Active Member
Given that you're already aware that it could cause a relapse, you're less likely to actually relapse.  But being aware gives you the control to monitor it.  If you start to ween off of them and your urges get insane, then you know before you relapse to get back to your regular dosage/times per day.  I'd be surprised if your urges didn't go up a little bit, if nothing else than just to trick yourself into thinking the meds are the cause.  But you've already named the risk, so I think you're in good shape if you decide to do it.

And the more energy at night thing?  Absolutely!  I love the night for some reason, just something about it that's more comforting and even exciting.  When I have long breaks from work I start to slip back into my college ways and staying up later and sleeping later even...but what you said, going to be early morning and then waking up at noon, I don't miss that.  I was always so tired from the lack of sleep.  But even exhausted all day, once night hits, I can still stay awake!  Strangest thing.
 

SebUK

Active Member
@Heartachekid: Haha yeah man, I always have so much more energy at night! It does seem more exciting somehow. Actually that's kind of interesting. I now think that my relapses are often triggered by needing excitement. Probably one way I'm trying to get the excitement I'm not currently getting from PMO is by staying up late and doing fun stuff like watching movies or ordering fast food (I've stopped doing this now too). My concern is when the excitement from this wears off, porn will become more desireable.

IN fact, I almost had a relapse last night (well morning, it was probably 2am). Just browsing youtube videos and started going through some triggering stuff while knowing I should be avoiding it. I stopped myself but still felt a little bad about it.

Excitement is definitely a factor...definitely.

Another problem is that we're currently in lockdown, so even if I had the energy (which I don't, not yet) I can't do anything exciting anyway. F*** COVID!

 

TheHeartacheKid

Active Member
Lockdown thing seriously sucks...fueled a lot of our addictions.  Good for you man for stopping yourself!  You're rolling right through this bitch!  F*** Covid indeed :).
 
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escapeandnevercomeback

Guest
SebNZ said:
IN fact, I almost had a relapse last night (well morning, it was probably 2am). Just browsing youtube videos and started going through some triggering stuff while knowing I should be avoiding it. I stopped myself but still felt a little bad about it.

This has happened to me a lot. I would say to myself: "A little bit won't damage my brain" and then I would feel depressed about having done that.
 

SebUK

Active Member
Well had a small relapse just before. Thankfully (?) it was only for about 15 minutes and it wasn't some of the more degrading material I've looked at in the past (still not great though). I held off that at least. This relapse has been building up for a few days. I relapsed when I was in my bedroom having a nap and stupidly (or on purpose) had my phone in the room. However at least due to the protections I have in place, the relapse was limited to stuff I could get on my phone and also didn't last long.

TBH I feel quite relieved now. There was pressure building up and it was good to let go. I feel a bit crappy but overall better off.

I know this isn't ideal but I'm trying to be pragmatic! If I only look at relatively mild porn every month for 15 minutes, that is pretty good going for me compared to what I've done in the past. I just need to keep building on that I guess. There is no silver bullet here :(

The other thing to note is that I've dropped my SSRIs to 50mg for about a week now. So this timing is...interesting. My mood is about the same as normal but I have noticed myself desiring some kind of buzz/excitement over the last week. I don't have anything coming in the mail (presents!) and I'm not working so I'm trying to be a bit tighter with money, so nothing there to look forward to. Movies are a little more boring to me than they were a few months ago. I'm not playing computer games at all anymore. The other hobbies I have are reading and music production. Both are great but are definitely not short term gratification hobbies. Oh, I have stopped eating junk food (I was eating Maccas like 3 times a week!). So all my short-term gratification behaviours have stopped, aside from TV/movies. This is probably a big cause for the relapse also.

So, I will have a cheat day on Saturday as a way of having some short term gratification. I need to think of other things too, but that's all that comes to mind at the moment.

It will also be interesting to see if my energy changes over the next day. If it goes up, I know it is due to the relapse. The paradox being having a relapse sometimes feels like a burden has been lifted, at least for a few days, until the guilt comes back.

So TL;DR: I had a relapse but I'm feeling okay about it, it was short and not too damaging (hopefully).

Oh and I will be keeping my phone out of the room again. The price of freedom is eternal vigilance :)

Hope everyone is doing well!
 
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