I need to up my game.

Phineas 808

Respected Member
There is only one thing I don't agree with, the idea of "Beast is our enemy." This is only my opinion, it's how I see everything. The addicted reptilian brain is not our enemy that we need to fight, it actually has a definitive job for our survival.

I agree with this, and I think the author understands this. If he calls it an enemy or treats it like one, he probably refers to the 'illusory self' that the beast/reptillian brain creates, which makes us 'think' that it's our true-self, wanting to drink, PMO, etc...

But you're right, one should never treat natural processes as an enemy, even if hijacked or used in maladaptive ways. Be compassionate with yourself always, even the 'warped' aspects. Seeing our addiction as an 'enemy' (and not ourselves) I think is important, but not the beast-brain as such, but the illusion that it creates.
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
I agree with this, and I think the author understands this. If he calls it an enemy or treats it like one, he probably refers to the 'illusory self' that the beast/reptillian brain creates, which makes us 'think' that it's our true-self, wanting to drink, PMO, etc...

But you're right, one should never treat natural processes as an enemy, even if hijacked or used in maladaptive ways. Be compassionate with yourself always, even the 'warped' aspects. Seeing our addiction as an 'enemy' (and not ourselves) I think is important, but not the beast-brain as such, but the illusion that it creates.
Okay, fair enough. Yes, I don't want to see the reptilian brain as an enemy because it only functions based on survival and spreading the genes, keeping the species going. Our mind, on the other hand, is other discussion. The book "The power of now" discusses the mind very well. For those who have a constant voice in their head that seems to take them down (me included).
 

Phineas 808

Respected Member
Day 3

Okay, after reading this in "Rational Recovery", I finally need to do it: I need to make the contract, to make that commitment with myself that I will not watch porn ever again in my life. Anytime I will get tempted, I will be stubborn and remember that I can't break the commitment. It's enough for now. I believe we complicate ourselves too much with this porn addiction, it could help to simplify it and for now I think this is simple enough: I don't want to break the commitment.

Awesome, man! Let me caution you in regards to one thing, it seems to give no room for error. This is understandable in that, to discover the 'real you' versus the 'beast-brain', and to discover that AV (addictive voice), we want to make such a commitment. But, what does one do with a lapse? I'm honestly sharing that I had this dilemma with making that commitment...

As I read further (in the book or elsewhere?), you have to think of it like, Today, I will never drink (or use PMO) ever again. Of course we never plan for a lapse, but how I made this work for me despite having a lapse is to always think in the present moment. For example, if I've lapsed, instead of wasting time beating myself up (which I was very prone to do), I would just think- from this time forward, I will never use again. And treat anything that even suggests future use as the AV.

Does this make sense?
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
Awesome, man! Let me caution you in regards to one thing, it seems to give no room for error. This is understandable in that, to discover the 'real you' versus the 'beast-brain', and to discover that AV (addictive voice), we want to make such a commitment. But, what does one do with a lapse? I'm honestly sharing that I had this dilemma with making that commitment...

As I read further (in the book or elsewhere?), you have to think of it like, Today, I will never drink (or use PMO) ever again. Of course we never plan for a lapse, but how I made this work for me despite having a lapse is to always think in the present moment. For example, if I've lapsed, instead of wasting time beating myself up (which I was very prone to do), I would just think- from this time forward, I will never use again. And treat anything that even suggests future use as the AV.

Does this make sense?
Yes, I understand you very well. You're right. Let's see how it will go.
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
I have to say this, man. This book "Rational Recovery" sounds even more helpful to me than Easy Peasy method. I will spend some time with this book in the days to come. It is a book about alcohol addiction and mentioning drugs sometimes but it can be applied to any addiction nevertheless because all addictions share common things.
 

zaraki888

Active Member
Okay, fair enough. Yes, I don't want to see the reptilian brain as an enemy because it only functions based on survival and spreading the genes, keeping the species going. Our mind, on the other hand, is other discussion. The book "The power of now" discusses the mind very well. For those who have a constant voice in their head that seems to take them down (me included).

True indeed about the survival part but if you are too compassionate with ''it'' staying friends, it might get you to drink and use porn again. Are you really sure you are not hearing your AV? Look at what porn and alcohol has done to your life.
I was also compassionate with it until it stabbed a knife in my back when least expected, while I was making my big plan the same day. Seducing, telling lies and luring me into wanting to have a peek or touching myself, while I want to abstain and stop ruin my life. I didn't recognize it as AV yet. I MO'd and then followed by sleeping problems.

Let's say you worked so hard to reach to 88 days and beyond and then a voice tells you to have one peek or a drink to celebrate. You recognize it as AV and you say, no I want to keep continuing my streak almost 90. ''AV: you can have just one peek, just be carefull. You are strong enough at this moment in time, you are not going to relapse. Just one visit won't hurt. Test youself to see how strong you have become. '' And then after one peek, you suddenly lose control and relapse.
How would you feel being on day 1 again? I mean you could stop yourself but got influenced by it like a fake friend. And then followed by the chaser effect and unable to get back to 88 days for some time. If you see it as an enemy, you would treat it as an enemy and you won't trust it. The AV will kill the host just to get it's pleasure. Look at how drug addicts behave and their looks. Look at how alchohol addicts take care of themselves, their lives. That is no friendly companion.
 

zaraki888

Active Member
@ zaraki88 ~ You discovered some of my own secret sauce, lol...! That book by Jack Trimpey (written toward alcoholism) taught me about AVRT (Addictive Voice Recognition Technique)! His book is also what Kathryn Hansen's work (toward eating disorders) is also based on. Because there's a lot of cross-application with how people deal with other addictions. I refer to AVRT in my 18 Principles.

Being able to separate your urges and cravings as 'lower brain' activity is so important in not confusing yourself with why, if we're supposedly wanting to quit, do we still have these drives? It's also empowering to realize that the lower brain, what Jack calls the 'Beast Brain' cannot really make us do anything, we always have power to veto or overrule anything it tells us to do.

@ Escape ~ I'm so sorry, bro, for your recent struggles. I know of the patterns your talking about, as the month of March typically means for me a time of relapse. But being aware of these patterns is good, so we can be aware, and breathe through the nonsense.

Brother, you can do a lot to fight this, for both fronts (P/MO and drinking). Zaraki's advice to check out that book is a must, a mandatory 'home work assignment'! Because it will be a game changer.

I would say a three-pronged approach is needed here, brother:

1. Easy Peasy Method (which I haven't myself read);

2. Rational Recovery (the book) for all addictions, not just alcohol; Other links: Rational Recovery Wiki; Alcohol: Problems and Solutions;

3. Mindfulness. Still challenge yourself to understand this as an all important tool. Other links: Mindworks.

Don't ever give up trying, Escape! Check out these links, set aside serious time for it, and get ahead of this thing!

Hello Phineas 808,

I didn't know you read the book Rational Recovery! Nice to know :) I should have read your 18 Principles earlier. I haven't finished reading yet as I am reading very careful and slow.
I read your 18 Principles and I like it a lot! I didn't know about Kathryn Hansen's work. Also interesting.

Thanks to Rational Recovery, I can finally learn to listen better to my intuition without the noise. I was always so confused.

Yes yes part 3. Mindfulness is what I forgot to mention very important :)
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
True indeed about the survival part but if you are too compassionate with ''it'' staying friends, it might get you to drink and use porn again. Are you really sure you are not hearing your AV? Look at what porn and alcohol has done to your life.
I was also compassionate with it until it stabbed a knife in my back when least expected, while I was making my big plan the same day. Seducing, telling lies and luring me into wanting to have a peek or touching myself, while I want to abstain and stop ruin my life. I didn't recognize it as AV yet. I MO'd and then followed by sleeping problems.

Let's say you worked so hard to reach to 88 days and beyond and then a voice tells you to have one peek or a drink to celebrate. You recognize it as AV and you say, no I want to keep continuing my streak almost 90. ''AV: you can have just one peek, just be carefull. You are strong enough at this moment in time, you are not going to relapse. Just one visit won't hurt. Test youself to see how strong you have become. '' And then after one peek, you suddenly lose control and relapse.
How would you feel being on day 1 again? I mean you could stop yourself but got influenced by it like a fake friend. And then followed by the chaser effect and unable to get back to 88 days for some time. If you see it as an enemy, you would treat it as an enemy and you won't trust it. The AV will kill the host just to get it's pleasure. Look at how drug addicts behave and their looks. Look at how alchohol addicts take care of themselves, their lives. That is no friendly companion.
I feel you, man. I know exactly what you're talking about. My addicted brain's favorite starting line is: "You can handle a little bit, you're problem is binging, be careful this time and you got it. 20 minutes, just one scene and that's it." And this starts the domino effect. Of course it comes back later and tells me other things that lead me to binges. But before reading the book, I didn't really see it like that, I've gained a new perspective since. Let's see how this will help me. The main obstacle is avoiding to act on the craving for pleasure.
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
Understanding that the addicted brain wants the pleasure, not me, is a big step, I'm telling you. Because there was always this voice in my head saying "I like the pleasure, I crave the pleasure!" but it was actually the addicted brain's voice. My lack of understanding kept the addicted brain hidden in plain sight. It became one with me and it stole the pronoun "I" and used it against me. It's not "I" crave the pleasure but "it" craves the pleasure. I don't want the pleasure, I don't need it. We need time and patience and eventually things will settle.
 

Phineas 808

Respected Member
I have to say this, man. This book "Rational Recovery" sounds even more helpful to me than Easy Peasy method. I will spend some time with this book in the days to come. It is a book about alcohol addiction and mentioning drugs sometimes but it can be applied to any addiction nevertheless because all addictions share common things.

Indeed, there's a lot of commonalities between various addictions. I've found help in researching how women deal with eating disorders, too. If you think about it, we all need to eat- and sex, too, is a natural biological function. So, these needs being so close to us, I learn from them.

Again, I learn from people who deal with OCD (especially with mindfulness training). Not saying one equals the other, but there's a lot of commonalities between OCD compulsions and addictive compulsions. Anxiety, PTSD, and of course Alcoholism and drug addiction, I've learned how to deal with my stuff from all these areas....

There's a lot of good stuff out there, a lot of help. Never despair, always learn.
 

Phineas 808

Respected Member
Understanding that the addicted brain wants the pleasure, not me, is a big step, I'm telling you. Because there was always this voice in my head saying "I like the pleasure, I crave the pleasure!" but it was actually the addicted brain's voice. My lack of understanding kept the addicted brain hidden in plain sight. It became one with me and it stole the pronoun "I" and used it against me. It's not "I" crave the pleasure but "it" craves the pleasure. I don't want the pleasure, I don't need it. We need time and patience and eventually things will settle.

I really like this, brother! Well said!
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
Indeed, there's a lot of commonalities between various addictions. I've found help in researching how women deal with eating disorders, too. If you think about it, we all need to eat- and sex, too, is a natural biological function. So, these needs being so close to us, I learn from them.

Again, I learn from people who deal with OCD (especially with mindfulness training). Not saying one equals the other, but there's a lot of commonalities between OCD compulsions and addictive compulsions. Anxiety, PTSD, and of course Alcoholism and drug addiction, I've learned how to deal with my stuff from all these areas....

There's a lot of good stuff out there, a lot of help. Never despair, always learn.
Well said, bro. You know, sometimes I like to study other addictions because studying about porn addiction and nofap actually makes me think about porn and crave porn. And like you said, you learn from them too, all addictions share things.
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
Day 5

The reptilian brain craves pleasure and wants to be entertained as if this is a motherfuckin amusement park. But fuck that. Being a slave of pleasure is one of the worst things you could do. Running obsessively after something that never feels enough and gives you absolutely nothing.
 

Robby82

Member
DAY 40



I feel really good in general physically and mentally I have been crossing the flatline for a few days now and I believe this is the beginning of true healing I can only tell you that now I understand things that I did not understand before about life and that almost everything in my life has improved. everyday I feel much more energy concentration strength self-esteem clarity desire for social relationship and I no longer feel a slave to anything or anyone come on guys think with your head think about the benefits of NOFAP and don't be influenced by today's shitty society that just wants to control us mind it's not worth jerking off to enjoy 5 seconds and ruin yourself !!!!
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
DAY 40



I feel really good in general physically and mentally I have been crossing the flatline for a few days now and I believe this is the beginning of true healing I can only tell you that now I understand things that I did not understand before about life and that almost everything in my life has improved. everyday I feel much more energy concentration strength self-esteem clarity desire for social relationship and I no longer feel a slave to anything or anyone come on guys think with your head think about the benefits of NOFAP and don't be influenced by today's shitty society that just wants to control us mind it's not worth jerking off to enjoy 5 seconds and ruin yourself !!!!
Good job, man. Keep up the good work.
 

DavS

Active Member
DAY 40



I feel really good in general physically and mentally I have been crossing the flatline for a few days now and I believe this is the beginning of true healing I can only tell you that now I understand things that I did not understand before about life and that almost everything in my life has improved. everyday I feel much more energy concentration strength self-esteem clarity desire for social relationship and I no longer feel a slave to anything or anyone come on guys think with your head think about the benefits of NOFAP and don't be influenced by today's shitty society that just wants to control us mind it's not worth jerking off to enjoy 5 seconds and ruin yourself !!!!
I totally agree with this post. You could use it for an affirmation.
 

Escapeandnevercomeback

Respected Member
Day 0

Relapse x 4. Drinking. What can I say? It's Christmas... Then the end of the year... I can't really stay sober in those two occasions but after this year is over I will make an effort to stay away from alcohol. This will help me with porn recovery for sure. I don't think I will post anything anymore in my journal until the end of the year, I don't really have anything more to say. I will return with new efforts.
 

zaraki888

Active Member
Day 0

Relapse x 4. Drinking. What can I say? It's Christmas... Then the end of the year... I can't really stay sober in those two occasions but after this year is over I will make an effort to stay away from alcohol. This will help me with porn recovery for sure. I don't think I will post anything anymore in my journal until the end of the year, I don't really have anything more to say. I will return with new efforts.

You can do this because this time you have Rational Recovery! The animal part has been exposed to you.

Take care
 
Last edited:
Top