Excited to be free

forestwater

Member
Day 41: I was happy to wait for longer, but my partner ended up feeling better, and we had sex. It was really good. I had another O, which I was happy about for several reasons:
  • It proved that last time was not an anomaly, and that I really can O to another person's touch now!
  • It took less time than last time, demonstrating that both of us are getting better at making this happen
  • I didn't go into the act thinking "I really want to orgasm from this." Instead, I went into it thinking, "This feels really good, and I would be content to just spend awhile feeling good without anything in particular happening." This shows that I'm making progress in healing from my "need" to reach climax
  • As someone who is easily distractible, I often close my eyes while experiencing pleasure so I can focus. But this time, whenever I opened my eyes and saw my partner, it turned me on even more. It seems like good evidence that I'm making progress rewiring. I'm gonna try and keep my eyes open more often
And, thankfully, no urges to PMO or even MO.

Now that I'm making this kind of progress, I think it's important to clarify something. I started this reboot after over a year of reducing my porn consumption due to being in a relationship, and after several months of even further reduction of usage due to living with my partner. This period of reduced consumption was by no means a reboot, since 1. It wasn't zero consumption, 2. I didn't know that porn was actually damaging; all I knew was that it made me feel kind of gross, and 3. I was still employing plenty of porn-related unhealthy attitudes & behaviors without realizing it. While PMO itself hadn't been a frequent habit for me for awhile, I was definitely in need of a reboot.

But despite that, I think my period of reduced consumption gave me a head start on my reboot. By the time I began my reboot, it was already fairly easy for me to avoid PMO, and I had already been rewiring (somewhat) to my partner.

I say this not to brag, but to be honest. I don't want anyone looking at my journal and getting frustrated by comparing themselves to me when they began their reboot under vastly different circumstances than I began mine. If I seem to be making progress "sooner" than other people might, there's a reason for that, and it's not because I'm in any way better. (Plus, I've still got a long ways to go.)

As has been said many times on here before, we all have a different reboot timeline which depends greatly on many, many factors. Whatever your factors may be, it's important to stick with this process and trust that it's going to make a difference. Good luck!

P.S.
Good good job on your journey! You seem to be making some great gains. It's funny (not really) what porn does to us, makes us sexualize everything and everyone, thinking we have a "right" to get off whenever we want. But that's not life, even for highly sexed couples. It's just a fact of life that you just can't have sex whenever you want, and that's okay. Porn, and all the associated problems that come with it, is never an option for anyone who wants a life of stability and true lasting happiness. Keep it up!
Thanks for the encouragement!

P.P.S.
About the environment that you think is not welcoming to woman.
I think a problem is, that on the one hand especially the NoFap-Community overlaps with Mans-Rights Activists who are against porn mainly because it makes man "weak" and follow the old, boring story of the evil woman who is tempting the man and on the other sadly big parts of self-proclaimend feminists are pro porn and think it is empowering and shit.
I really think this forum is good, because I know the people behind it are against sexual exploitation, too, but on the other hand there are also many conservative guys here (especially in the 40+ section, better not go there =D).
That's why I think it is very valuable to have the insights of woman who are partners and suffer from the addiction of their man on the one hand and woman who are addicted themselfes on the other, so it is not only men talking about their problems and partly trying to find someone to blame for it.

I think it would be very helpful or at least interesting to hear what makes you feel unwelcomed as a woman and like if you would share your view with us.
Thanks for your perspective. That all makes sense. I don't have time right now to share my experience as a woman on this forum, but maybe within the next few days I will.
 
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Deleted member 26092

Guest
About the environment that you think is not welcoming to woman.
I think a problem is, that on the one hand especially the NoFap-Community overlaps with Mans-Rights Activists who are against porn mainly because it makes man "weak" and follow the old, boring story of the evil woman who is tempting the man and on the other sadly big parts of self-proclaimend feminists are pro porn and think it is empowering and shit.

Very interesting! I often caught myself thinking badly about women during older streaks. For example, I developed a real hatred for women in the entertainment industry. News hosts, YouTuber, streamer, etc. At some point I realized that they are not the problem but I am. It's my responsibility to resist the seduction attempts (if any). That was such an unhealthy and harmful way of looking at things.
Other than that, I read @forestwater 's journal with curiosity and learn quite a bit. You are definitely welcome here!
 

forestwater

Member
Day 42: Yesterday I had another flashback to an old P scene, and I had a weird thought that was along the lines of, "That really turned me on. That's probably the kind of thing I'll watch when I go back to porn again." But then immediately I was like, "Wait, what? I'm never going back to porn again, and so I'll never watch that kind of video again." That thought then made me sad, which is absolutely wild to me.

Usually when you're sad about losing something, it's because that thing made you happy, and the sadness is from being deprived of that happiness. But porn didn't make me happy; it just gave me progressively stronger hits of dopamine while making the rest of my life worse. I shouldn't be sad to lose that! I should be (and usually am) ecstatic to be free of it.

Come to think of it, it reminds me of my abusive ex. Because of the way the cycle of abuse works, my ex wasn't constantly horrible to me. The "honeymoon" stage of the cycle was thrilling, pleasurable, and probably full of dopamine. But in between the honeymoon periods, the abuse was bad enough that it made my life worse in every way. It became harder and harder to spend time with friends & family, enjoy my hobbies, and pursue my goals. I fell into a depression.

One day I realized, "My life didn't use to be this way," which came not long before realizing, "My life doesn't have to be this way." That's why, as soon as I got the chance, I broke up with my abuser. You would expect me to feel joy and relief, right? Yes, there was a little of that. But mostly? I was sad. Even though my ex was so awful to me, we still had a bond (albeit a really unhealthy one), and bonds are painful to break.

Being sad about leaving my ex did NOT mean that I should have stayed in that relationship. If I had, I wouldn't have met the wonderful person that my current partner is! Similarly, being sad about letting go of porn does NOT mean I should keep using it. It's just that bonds (whether to people or habits) can be difficult to break, even when they're bad for you. I don't need to try to make the sadness go away, because it'll go away on its own, but I can keep reminding myself that I'm far better off without porn.

Because I am. And so are you. Let's stay smart together.
 

forestwater

Member
Day 43: Had a dream with some pornographic content in it. Well, not exactly, but it involved me getting turned on to the image of other people having sex, so pretty much. However, in the dream itself, I remember thinking, "No, I've walked away from this kind of thing," and the dream changed direction immediately to something else. I count that as evidence that while some part of me still craves P, there is just as big of a part of me that is willing to make sure I don't fall back into it. Even my subconscious is on board.

Here's to staying smart for one more day!
 
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Deleted member 26092

Guest
You're making good progress and pretty much near the success. Remember zero interaction with the addictive substance/behaviour is the key
Yes! You wouldn't let an alcoholic work in a liquor store, would you?
 

forestwater

Member
Day 45: I ended up MO'ing again (no P, no fantasy). I think it's hard for me to stay away from that for too long, because I do have a reasonably high libido and I don't want to put the sole responsibility for it on my partner. Rewiring fully is important to me, but so is sustainability. Also, it's just hard to talk myself out of. Talking myself out of P is easy, since I can point to several tangible ways that it harms me and zero ways that it helps me. However, with MO, I can't see any confirmed ways that it harms me, only ways that it potentially could do so, and I can point to at least one way that it helps me. Note: I am speaking from my experience only. I know MO is noticeably unhelpful for many of the guys here, but it doesn't seem to be affecting me in the same way.

My plan is this: If I get tangible proof that MO is unhelpful for me, I will stop completely. Until then, I will continue to do it, but in a controlled way; at least every other O I have must be from my partner's touch. Ideally all of my Os will come from my partner, but the absolute minimum will be half. (And it should go without saying, but P and fantasy will never be involved.) I hope this system will allow me to rewire in a way that is sustainable for both me and my partner.

In other news, I would once again highly recommend Karezza to anyone in a relationship. My partner and I did some more yesterday, and I'm still riding the high from how incredible and romantic it felt. It's hard to say how helpful it is to my rewire (no tangible evidence from that either) but I'd like to think that it is.

Good luck to all of you!
 

Honey98$

Member
Day 45: I ended up MO'ing again (no P, no fantasy). I think it's hard for me to stay away from that for too long, because I do have a reasonably high libido and I don't want to put the sole responsibility for it on my partner. Rewiring fully is important to me, but so is sustainability. Also, it's just hard to talk myself out of. Talking myself out of P is easy, since I can point to several tangible ways that it harms me and zero ways that it helps me. However, with MO, I can't see any confirmed ways that it harms me, only ways that it potentially could do so, and I can point to at least one way that it helps me. Note: I am speaking from my experience only. I know MO is noticeably unhelpful for many of the guys here, but it doesn't seem to be affecting me in the same way.

My plan is this: If I get tangible proof that MO is unhelpful for me, I will stop completely. Until then, I will continue to do it, but in a controlled way; at least every other O I have must be from my partner's touch. Ideally all of my Os will come from my partner, but the absolute minimum will be half. (And it should go without saying, but P and fantasy will never be involved.) I hope this system will allow me to rewire in a way that is sustainable for both me and my partner.

In other news, I would once again highly recommend Karezza to anyone in a relationship. My partner and I did some more yesterday, and I'm still riding the high from how incredible and romantic it felt. It's hard to say how helpful it is to my rewire (no tangible evidence from that either) but I'd like to think that it is.

Good luck to all of you!
Hown are you feeeling after MO'ing ?? Is there some reduced libido or anything similar? Or it isn't affecting you that way?
Are you taking any supplements for libido??

In my opinion you're improving fast because you're libido is just above good level as you mentioned. Apparently, You've not heavily injured your brain as most of the guys did here. You're just some little paces away from full recovery. Just avoid orgasm and emphasize on building sexual tension within with your partner. May the force be with you!!!
Keep crushing it!!
 
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forestwater

Member
Day 48: Nothing much to report, still chugging along. Every day matters.

Hown are you feeeling after MO'ing ?? Is there some reduced libido or anything similar? Or it isn't affecting you that way?
Are you taking any supplements for libido??

In my opinion you're improving fast because you're libido is just above good level as you mentioned. Apparently, You've not heavily injured your brain as most of the guys did here. You're just some little paces away from full recovery. Just avoid orgasm and emphasize on building sexual tension within with your partner. May the force be with you!!!
Keep crushing it!!
Thanks! In my experience, MO just makes me feel relaxed and happy. It takes the urgency out of my libido, but doesn't seem to actually reduce it; in fact, it seems like it even increases the desire I feel for my partner. (I still don't want to do it too often, but for reasons other than libido.) And no, I'm not taking any supplements for libido. I just try to lead a fairly healthy lifestyle.
 

forestwater

Member
Day 49: Still going! It's been over a week since my partner and I last had sex, and I'm definitely noticing the effects of that. It's weird; sometimes it feels like the longer we go without, the more we lose momentum, and the more effort it takes to get back into it. That's okay though, I think we will soon. Until then I will not MO, and definitely not PMO.
 

forestwater

Member
Day 50: Milestone! While this is probably not the longest amount of time I've gone without P, it is my longest streak while 1. knowing how destructive porn is, and 2. committing to never consume it again. I'm proud of myself.

In other news, my partner and I had sex last night. (Isn't it funny how that tends to happen after I post about how we haven't had sex in awhile?) It took me even less time & effort to O this time, which I take as a sign of progress. However, I found it hard to get (and stay) wet, and once my partner was inside me, it wasn't long before it became too uncomfortable and we had to stop. Lube helped, but there's only so much it can do.

Clearly I'm still having trouble maintaining arousal with my partner, which is frustrating. I know the rewiring process doesn't happen overnight, but given all the other progress I've been making, I assumed that this aspect wouldn't be far behind. I'm not sure what to do to help it along (besides all the other stuff I've been doing, like Karezza).
 

forestwater

Member
Day 52: I had a really nice chat with my partner about my progress. It's lovely to be met with support and encouragement, rather than hurt and disappointment. Neither of us know exactly how to get the arousal signals to make the leap from my conscious mind into my body, but we'll keep trying things out together until something sticks.

Because I have so little clue about how to make that happen, I started doing some research on female arousal. What followed was probably the most pointless 15 minutes of my life. First, there was the barrage of articles by and for men (because obviously sex is something men do to women and not something women have any agency in :rolleyes:) and those consisted mostly of "do foreplay!" like that's some hot tip instead of a very basic component of good sex. Then, when I managed to find articles by and for women, they focused only on self-pleasure, and tended to boil down to either 1."feel good about yourself!" or 2. "consume porn!", neither of which are helpful because I feel great about myself and I'm never going back to porn.

I'm gonna keep following the rewiring tips in this forum, but otherwise, I'm at a loss for what to do. Surely it's possible; I know some women who can get dripping wet just from making out. I don't know how they do it, but hopefully someday I'll found out.
 
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Deleted member 26092

Guest
Then, when I managed to find articles by and for women, they focused only on self-pleasure, and tended to boil down to either 1."feel good about yourself!" or 2. "consume porn!", neither of which are helpful because I feel great about myself and I'm never going back to porn.
Yeah, let's watch porn, body positivity, sex positivity, bla bla ... o_O:sleep: I am always smh when I come across these kinds of articles.
 

Carl_Smith

Active Member
Hey, I read your post. I'm glad Easy Peasy worked for you.
Can I share one good free sex ed video I've seen:
I think she is a good sex ed coach.. she helped me and my wife a lot.
 

forestwater

Member
Day 57: Still no porn, and no MO either. Instead, I have three things to report.

The first is that a few days ago, my partner and I had amazing sex that ended up bringing me to O twice. It was faster and easier than previous times, and I count that as progress. However, afterwards, I felt a drop in my mood and a feeling of reduced intimacy with my partner. I recovered after awhile and we ended up having a very romantic evening, but I think my drop in mood stemmed from the double O. I think I am going to set limits with myself about that; I don't want to get so greedy for orgasm that my life and relationship are affected as a result. I will 1. continue my effort to deprioritize orgasm, and 2. keep it to a maximum of one O per session.

The second thing is that I have finally begun a daily meditation practice. It's too soon to see any results from it, but I hope this will not only aid in my reboot, but also help me to be a healthier and better person overall. If anyone wants to get started on meditation but doesn't know where to begin, I recommend the Healthy Minds Program, which is what I've been using.

The third thing is that my partner recently performed a tantric massage on me. It was really lovely, and allowed me to use my new meditation skills to get in tune with my body and how the massage was making me feel. Part of it involved a yoni massage, and while that felt wonderful, it didn't arouse me because I was simply too relaxed. Every time my partner focused on my sweet spots, I would get a little tingle of arousal, but then it would fade due to my deep breathing. This made me worried about the portion of the yoni massage where a finger gets inserted into the vagina, because if I wasn't aroused, then that might hurt. But it didn't! It actually felt lovely and relaxing.

Tantric massage was the first time I'd ever been touched "down there" in a way that wasn't focused on sexual pleasure & climax, but rather on healing & relaxation. I am not sure if it will assist in my reboot/rewire (like with the meditation, it's probably too soon to know) but it was a beautiful experience that I would recommend.
 

Carl_Smith

Active Member
That's awesome. My wife likes some gentle "taps" on her yoni as part of the foreplay, to mix it up. The vibrations go deeper into the body.
Tantric yoni massage/sex is not something I've ever seen in porn or hollywood movies, but it is real sacred sex. Glad you and your partner found it. (And I like it because my hands can go forever, whereas my other part can't). Did you try using coconut oil?

And I know what you mean about the comedown after sex. My wife have sex about every 3 weeks, which is fine for us, but I'm wiped out and tired for hours afterward. Orgasm is essentially a drug.
 

forestwater

Member
Tantric yoni massage/sex is not something I've ever seen in porn or hollywood movies, but it is real sacred sex. Glad you and your partner found it. (And I like it because my hands can go forever, whereas my other part can't). Did you try using coconut oil?
We didn't use coconut oil because we didn't have any (very expensive where we live). We just went with lotion (for the majority of the body) and lube (for the yoni bit) and that worked out pretty well. And yeah, I am surprised at how this forum was the first place I'd heard of tantric massage/sex even though it's clearly not a new thing.

Day 58: My sex drive is pretty high right now due to hormones but I am choosing to avoid MO. I know it wouldn't be the end of the world if I were to do it, but I want to channel my sexual energy into something that will actively be good for me, instead of something that's just "not that bad."
 

forestwater

Member
Day 63: Last night I had a dream in which I was watching a sexy music video, got turned on, and became tempted me to MO. (Or maybe PMO since the arousal had come from watching the video?) In the dream I caught myself, and told myself very firmly, "I am NEVER going back to porn or any porn substitutes." Despite that, and despite the fact that the feeling of arousal disappeared upon waking up, it still felt too close to comfort.

What's interesting, though, is that it was a music video. I've never used that as fodder for PMO before; I think a part of my brain was thinking, "it's been so long since I've PMO'd that it would probably not take that explicit of a video to get me off." Which must mean I'm making progress? At any rate, I should stay away from music videos just in case.

The other day my partner and I had some pretty good sex. We were doing things that felt great to both of us, but aren't the kinds of things that have ever made me O. There were a couple of points where we considered doing something that we know does make me O, but we came to the conclusion that the motivation for that would have been solely orgasm, which I am trying to avoid. Not orgasm, specifically, but the mindset of treating sex (or specific sex acts) as a fancy orgasm-dispenser, rather than the beautiful sharing of intimacy that I want it to be.

A big role model for me in this process is actually my partner, who never goes into sex with the intent to cum, but instead goes in with the intent to have fun & feel good & increase intimacy. Any orgasm that might happen is enjoyable, but incidental to the overall goal. That's how I want to be - I value myself and my partner too much to treat our bedroom adventures as simply a means to a selfish end.

Still generally tempted to MO (it's been like a week and a half since my last O, and my body is... aware) but I'm not sure if it's a good idea.
 
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