Objectifying Women

As I enter my third week of rebooting, like everyone else it's pretty much been the number one topic on my mind. But for whatever reason I seem to be gaining a clarity on my history of objectifying women. Old memories are coming back of times going back 40 years where my sole attraction to a woman might be her great breasts or to simply have sex with her. Hair and face and body and breasts belly and legs were all that mattered to me. She could have had the personality of a rattlesnake. If she was hot, I was infatuated. This happened everywhere I went. Every day. As the memories come back they are like reality checks on who I've been and how long I've been that piece of shit.
Then when porn started on the internet my views in the real world went crazy. For the longest time I couldn't understand what was wrong with me every time a woman I crossed paths with went through my mental "what would it be like to screw her" process.  I would sit across a table with a woman at a meeting and while the topic was business, my mind wasn't even there. It happened every single time. Not understanding it drove me crazy too. I thought I was insane! I even acted on my fantasies with three women. Nothing physical. No stalking behavior. There was no physical assault or anything. I simply  did sweet things for them, declared my love, all the while simply wanting to get in their drawers.  One of them just laughed it off. Another, my actions completely destroyed a longtime friendship and the third was wise enough to just let it roll off her back and forget about it.
Now, as I make progress here and watch videos over on YBOP, I'm gaining a better understanding of my affliction. And with that, along from abstinence from PM, I find that it seems to be subsiding already. In only the past two weeks, without the crash-bash stimulation of HD porn, I really seem to be getting some control on my thoughts and any woman I speak to no longer instantly becomes a sexual fantasy. 
Anyhow, that's me. Maybe my entry will help somebody else here. I'd also welcome any feedback.
Everybody take care of yourselves
 

sonofJack

Member
It's a good sign that you're already feeling results. Stay on the path. Read the other journals. Tell us how you're doing, and most of all, get on here fast when you struggle.
 

LTE

Administrator
Staff member
Admin
Moderator
Learning not to objectify women is an important step of breaking free. Breaking the Cycle, by George Collins, really helped me with this. It does get easier in time.
 
S

SO Reboot Partner

Guest
Congrats on two weeks and a day closer to freedom!

Love reading your journal entries.
 

fugu

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
I definitely have noticed similar things during my reboot. I objectified women a TON.
 
I wish I could recall who wrote it on Reboot, but when I first joined I read that a good approach for someone wanting to begin dealing with objectifying is the following: upon initial contact with whatever gender or feature trips your trigger, recognize your crap right away, let it run a couple seconds and then consciously shut it off. After a while the reality of what's going on overcomes the fantasy and helps the pattern diminish over time. Well, I have to say thank you to whomever posted that advice because it has helped me immensely!  Oh hell, I'm just starting and sure as hell not cured, but I feel like I'm on the right path. If you're still struggling with objectifying. Give it a try.

How I love settings for interaction among people who are there for each other in healing or dealing with whatever the particular mayhem is that has brought them together.
I'm new to dealing with this nightmarish mess that threatens my sanity and my marriage. But for those who come here never having worked a sharing process like this before, you have arrived in the right place. For 22 years, belief in this process of recovery has kept me sober so I know it works. I am really glad I found this place. You are saving my life.
 

Tclay

Active Member
Wanttobebetter
I'm maybe 1/2 step ahead of you with my reboot so while I'm rooting for you, I am reluctant to give a lot of advise.  But LTE's advise on the book, Breaking the Cycle should be considered seriously.  Here you will find effective techniques for addressing urges, understanding the original wound, and sustaining the battle.... Well worth the time.
 

fcjl8

Active Member
I found it took serious conscious effort not to objectify women... at first. I had done it for decades so it was hard to break the habit.

Now, it is may natural way. It takes little effort I just naturally might notice a lady who passes me but I look no further. No lust, so to speak... no checking her out as she walks away. It feels much healthier!
 
That is just what I am Beginning to discover.  Where three weeks ago I felt helpless, I now have a process that appears is working.
Per LTE recommendation I also ordered Breaking the Cycle. It continues to amaze me how overwhelming PM had become in my life. But now, knowledge is power, and I'm finding knowledge here.
 

LTE

Administrator
Staff member
Admin
Moderator
fcjl8 said:
I found it took serious conscious effort not to objectify women... at first. I had done it for decades so it was hard to break the habit.

Now, it is may natural way. It takes little effort I just naturally might notice a lady who passes me but I look no further. No lust, so to speak... no checking her out as she walks away. It feels much healthier!
I've noticed that same in myself. I notice, but not in the same way as I used to. I think that it involves a shift in my thinking process.
 
One more thing about objectifying women. I did it with virtually every encounter. I would sit there staring at her while she spoke to me about something totally business related. I'd be nodding my head while I'd be wondering if she's wearing a thong, what her breasts look like, if she likes oral, what she'd look like at the foot of the bed naked, insane stuff like that. I was really a horrible piece of shit.
Remarkably I'd be sitting there in a complete fantasy haze with total ED.  Not only were the thoughts making me question my sanity, the reality that I hadn't seen an erection for several years made the whole thing completely frustrating and depressing. 
Already I'm gaining control of these fantasies, and with the help of patient touch my wife and I are becoming more intimate again...slowly. Viagra is my friend, but that is okay. To actually find myself erect as a result of my wife's body and touch is amazing.
And when I'm on the street or one on one with a woman during normal business activities, I'm getting a handle on wondering crazy stuff about whether she likes things stuffed in her butt or if her vagina is waxed. Yikes. I was there, but I've begun climbing out and the knowledge and the sunshine feel mighty good!
Thanks
 
S

SO Reboot Partner

Guest
I have been skeeved on more than one occasion by the daydreaming negotiator. Don't think this is unique to you or that it can be always unseen by the lady sitting across the table.
 
S

SO Reboot Partner

Guest
Wanttobebetter said:
Yikes SO, I should've got slapped or worse time ten thousand times!

More than likely you were simply taken advantage of and didn't even realize it.
 

Viper

Well-Known Member
SO Reboot Partner said:
I have been skeeved on more than one occasion by the daydreaming negotiator. Don't think this is unique to you or that it can be always unseen by the lady sitting across the table.

So I have to ask...
what does that make you think of the man who's gawking or clearly making his eyes wander down to your cleavage?

I got to know what goes through your mind. I'm definitely guilty of objectifying women but I've been reducing the problem.
My struggle with that is well documented within the confines of this forum. But I'd like to hear more thoughts on this from the ladies.
 

Gracie

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
When I was young and in my 20's, looking was okay.  I did not like it if it felt creepy.  Like looking at a body part or someone older than me looking.  Older than me meant exactly that, I did not date anyone older.

But when my husband and I started down the path to recovery, I noticed he looked a lot.  He used to as well, but now it felt really different.  I guess I now felt I knew his motivation.  It was horrible at that point.  So I pointed it out to him every time.  He would deny, but his whole face looked different when it was ogling and not just a look.  And he would always claim he was looking at something else in his range of vision.  Like did you see that little kid?  He was so cute?
Yeah right....  Then as he changed, he started noticing the men ogling me.  He did not like it.  Of course he knew what they were thinking.  Then the light bulb went off and he realized how I felt when he looked.  And now, having went through this with him, I do not like men ogling me.  I do not like seeing men ogle anyone.  It looks creepy. Especially when the girls are young.  It looks like they are ogling their grandaughters and that is just yuck.  Below is what helped us with ogling.  It comes from James Compulsion Solutions.  The director is George Collins, author of Breaking the Cycle.

Dear Porn Doc:
One of my biggest problems isn?t necessarily looking at porn?but rather looking at women?a lot. In fact, I am often not even aware that I am doing it and have really gotten into trouble with both my current girlfriend as well as in past relationships. What are some tips in stopping this?



Porn Doc:
You have a ?looker.? In fact, most men are visual creatures anyway, but when you also struggle with compulsive sexual behavior, the looking takes on more of an obsessive quality. ?I can?t stop looking.? ?If I don?t look, I?ll miss out on something.? To bring a deeper awareness to your looking, I recommend the following interventions as some short-term solutions:

1. The Two-Second Rule?A simple intervention is to use a two-second rule. This is essentially a self-monitoring tool to establish some control and boundaries around the looking. When a person notices that he is indeed looking too much, he then gives himself ?permission? to look one time and one time only, up to two seconds. The idea is if you are aware enough to slap a limit on the looking, then they are aware that they are crossing the line.

2. Other Women?s Body Parts Aren?t My Business?Men reveal that they often feel obligated to look, as if it?s their job. Or they might worry that they will miss out on something. A simple reminder?or mantra?is to remind yourself that the woman who has caught your attention is none of your business; she does not know you; she did not wear those clothes for you; she does not welcome you. You need not look.

3. She Is A Person?Obsessive looking usually involves objectifying. Notice your language when you?re looking and what you are saying (internally or out loud). You may be saying to yourself something like: ?Look at those breasts!? ?Look at that butt, those legs.? The list goes on. Remind yourself that she is a person by lending her some humanity. She is somebody?s daughter. She is somebody?s sister. She is somebody?s mother. She is somebody. Not an object.

You need not be a heterosexual male to use this. We have many gay clients too who look at other men in much the same way and find these interventions useful too.
We invite you to look at our blog on this very topic at addictionblog.org for more information.
 

Viper

Well-Known Member
Well Gracie,
thanks for that input and I already know which one I am:


Looking because I feel like I'm missing out on something.

And the arena this takes place is usually the mall.
I don't count night clubs/bars because lets face it...those are designed to meet, greet, and hook-up.

First and foremost, I agree that it's bad and I don't know if you've read any of
my posts, but I've been open and ashamed of my part in this. I've also given some tips to curb this
bad habit because it has adverse
effects on my reboot and my SO. And even if I was totally single, it's just immature
and has bad form. And I have females in my life and if I ever saw some dude totally
rubbernecking my niece or whomever, I would be repulsed.

With that said, my niece or any family member including my SO does not dress or have
the attitude of the women who in my opinion are trying their best to draw the attention.
I'm not saying that it makes it right. But I would like if you may, share your thoughts
about the women who actually want the attention and do you think they are part of the
problem?

I'm talking about the woman you see in a community dressing room who is trying on
a pair of jeans and when they do, the first thing they look at in the mirror is their butt.
And they're trying to find the right contours that will make it look more impressive and
will even ask their buddy how their ass look. Whatever happen to "Do you think it's to
loose around the thighs?" or "Should I get it altered around the ankles?"

I'm also talking about the woman who wear tops with very deep cleavage and I've
actually caught a friend of mine totally adjusting her top for the desired effect.
She even dipped towards the mirror to see what anyone else would see if someone
else had that vantage point. What is up with that?

Again, all these antics does not justify or entitle me to ogle. Because it's wrong but
do you think that some (remember, i say some, not most) women out there can take
some responsibility?

 

Gracie

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
I would have to say that I think women and girls are influenced by what society places a premium on.  You only have to access any media to learn that women must have numerous attributes all of which must be firm and un-cellulited with no stretch marks and above all no wrinkles.  Once we know what the premium is we strive to make ourselves match that ideal.  And we often will use any means to achieve that ideal.  We use surgery that costs tens of thousands of dollars.  We participate in the billion dollar industry of beauty products.  And all sorts of creams and lotions. 

At the end yes there is dressing to look more attractive.  Not saying that it is all for sex but we do.
 

chicken

Active Member
Okay...I am putting up my hand as a compulsive oogler.  I have am also one of the dumb variety who doesn't (didn't) think that anyone could notice....wrong wrong wrong!  I have been curbing this habit for a while now and use a catch and release formula.  I am getting better.  Now I actually notice men around me staring at other women.  It is creepy.  Now I love women, almost everything about the female form I find attractive, I think that is quite natural, and I think that it is okay to admire a beautiful women.  What I am trying to accomplish is to not put them in a fantasy.  So the 2 second....I actually try to be less then 1 second...rule works best for me.  I am not in a point in my recovery where I am able to overpower all of my thoughts but I am working towards that.

Thanks for this thread Wanttobe
 

Viper

Well-Known Member
Gracie said:
I would have to say that I think women and girls are influenced by what society places a premium on.  You only have to access any media to learn that women must have numerous attributes all of which must be firm and un-cellulited with no stretch marks and above all no wrinkles.  Once we know what the premium is we strive to make ourselves match that ideal.  And we often will use any means to achieve that ideal.  We use surgery that costs tens of thousands of dollars.  We participate in the billion dollar industry of beauty products.  And all sorts of creams and lotions. 

At the end yes there is dressing to look more attractive.  Not saying that it is all for sex but we do.

That sounds rational to me.
It's a catch 22. Women want to be admired for their looks, just not objectified.
You can glance, just not stare. Then there are the women who spend a lot of time
on their looks and claim that men should like them for their personalities.
Again, not all women. And then there are the aging women who used to
be the prize head-turner in her formidable years and actually miss the ogling to
some degree. Of course, that woman hates the 24/25 year olds that look
really good. That used to be her. She used to be the lady in the office that
all the guys would come to visit. Now a younger model has been released
from the assembly line and some jealousy ensues. LoL,
YOu know I'm right  ;D

Thanks for your opinion.
 
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