Topic 1268 (Journal)

[bob]

idunno,

It sounds like your wife is unaware of what is happening with your reboot.

author=idunno link=topic=17053.msg175791#msg175791 date=1559150177]
Maybe I should open up with her at some point about it. We'll see. I probably will, but not at the moment.
[/quote]

I would encourage you to let her in. I am sure she knows something is going on. While you will know best, I feel that the brutal honesty is the best course. It is not easy. It can be painful but I found it to be helpful for me.

Just a thought.

Stay the course either way you do things. It is worth it.

Peace

 

[idunno]

Now it's 40 days. This effort feels so much different than every other effort I've made over the last 25 years. I remember once I returned an adult video to a store, and the owner accused me of opening the video and switching out the tape with another, which I hadn't done. He demanded $30 or something for the cost of the video. It was weird -- I went right into this thing where I said I didn't have the money, and then I said, almost pleaded, "But I'm not watching these videos anymore! I'm not doing this anymore!" As if that had anything to do with the situation from his perspective! But I spoke out of a real desperation. And I remember his reply, a sort of smile (a smirking one, which I imagined as gloating), and he said, "Yeah, sure!"

During that same period, I snuck porn sessions on my housemates' VCR, and used my other housemate's computer to view pictures (there was no video at the time). I even remember the dial-up sound, which I'll forever associate with his room and my feeling of impending excitement. He knew, but didn't really care. Open-minded to a fault, maybe.

These sorts of memories are a feature of everywhere I lived as a younger adult. Using friends' devices for porn, or finding their stash and using their porn. The list would be a long one. Many different houses, apartments, and housemates. And the various adult video stores I always found in the neighborhood of various cities I lived in. It's true I was lost, or lacked direction, but the urban hipster life didn't provide many obstacles to frequent porn use.

If I characterize my life now, it consists simply in not using porn, and enduring whatever boredom, anxiety, or trouble comes my way. Emotionally and sexually, I feel like a piece of dried out, barren land. But every day that I go on, somehow it gets a little better. Maybe some day I'll have a sex life with my wife again (and honestly, I've never had a sex life -- only first and foremost a porn life, of which sex was a small portion). Maybe some day I'll be able to be around large groups of people without subconsciously oggling women. But I'm not setting my expectations too high. The important thing is to continue on without porn. I really do trust that however things develop, it will be for the best. I try to resist the urge to manage them. And due to the fact that my porn use went on for so many years, and was so intense, I feel I owe it to myself to face the consequences however long they last. And really, this journal and this community is what's making the difference this time.

 

[Jbow]

Your doing great brother. I have to say about looking at women, and being in social events. All those problems your having are related to porn use. The porn has absolutely altered your mind. The longer you are free of porn, I promise that stuff gets better. When I see a pretty lady, I glance at her and smile at her. It's nothing creepy, I just smile. It's hard to explain,  but I promise,  things will be better the longer you pmo free. Stay strong and and please stay away from porn. Things are so awesome when it's out of your life.

 

[J01]

How is it going?  Check-in if you get a chance.  Take care!

 

[idunno]

Thank you, jixu and Jbow. Still going. 55 Days now. Had a weekend with my ailing (slowly dying) father. It's always been hard to be with him. Excruciating. I've always felt there were so many issues, a complete disconnect between us. The weekend was fine, but it wore me out. There were all these other people in the picture who I don't know very well. I "showed up," and did my duty as best I could. So I'm still here, just not feeling great.

 

[switched_off_again]

Hi Idunno - as others have said, so much of what you have written resonates with my own experience. Being anxious about my leeriness, not knowing if porn has contributed to my sterile sex life, or vice versa, at times feeling comfortable with porn but knowing that it really isn't good for me - that dreadful melancholic empty feeling the day after...

And sorry to read of the other stresses in your life - again I can empathise with this - but I'll shut up - it's your journal, not mine!

Stay strong and hope the mood lifts soon. One thing I have learned from the roller coaster I have been on since last September, is the porn induced times of anxiety and depression are only temporary - I've had lots of real ups along the way to!

 

[J01]

Great to hear from you-nice work on the 55.  It isn't easy with ailing parents-raw difficulties, no other way to put it. 

 

[idunno]

Thank you jixu.

64 days now. I've probably gone that long before a few times. I remind myself that I don't know what the future holds in terms of this current effort. I still can't see myself going back, but who knows.

I probably have personality issues to deal with. I'm cranky much of the time, fairly paranoid about other people and their intentions. I've got my share of bitterness about life, and about people around me. Porn never helped any of these things, obviously. But it's not like I take porn out of the picture and all of the sudden there's this great life there waiting for me. Withdrawal from a long-time crutch or substance can lead to these feelings, I know, but to some degree I think I'm just like that. Using porn was an escape from the unpleasant feelings that arise from these issues. It compounded the issues, but they pre-exist my porn use.

 

[idunno]

Here's a way I think porn has affected me, that I've been thinking about lately. It has to do with being in conflict with others. It could be an argument with my spouse, or a disagreement with someone I'm doing some project with, or even a small conflict with someone out in public. I'm a conflict-averse person anyway, and tend to be late on the uptake (not realizing I've been slighted or treated badly until the incident is over and it's too late to respond, then I stew!). But porn has made it much worse, by increasing this sense that I don't have any legs to stand on when it comes to taking a position against someone else.

How it works is that inwardly, I somehow feel like I deserve every bad thing that happens to me, because of the pathetic level I've sunk to with porn. I don't feel any inner strength when it comes to holding my ground against someone else in an argument -- after all, I haven't even had the barest of inner strength to stop porn masturbation for the last 30 years. Hopefully that latter part is changing now. But in conflict, as my mind searches around to justify or find weaknesses in my own position, and in the position of the person I'm in conflict with (when my mind's in "battle mode"), I often end up thinking suddenly of my porn use.

It appears in my mind in a harsh, self-deprecatory light, as proof that I'm disingenuous and don't deserve respect. It's like: how can I expect to assert myself in a conflict with someone when, if they knew the truth, they'd laugh their ass off at this pathetic spectacle of me in my porn frenzy? How can I even consider taking up a principled position on anything, when I have no principles? That's how the thinking goes, anyway. It's one of the ways my perception of my porn use has come into play. Just knowing that I'm a porn addict has me sunk before a conflict even begins. Like I said, conflict is hard for me anyway, but porn has made it worse. I can't look other people in the eye, maybe because the truth is too painful.

 

[workinprogressUK]

So many "ditto" moments reading your posts, idunno. Not using P doesn't make me happier. Not using P doesn't make me more likeable. Not using P has left me in an existence where I have to face all the unresolved issues that I used to medicate with P.

The fact that you used P for years doesn't make you a bad person. You started to use P for a reason. Maybe that was a result of trauma or emotional difficulties and P helped you to not feel the pain for a while? Maybe not. But it became a habit that self-perpetuated and, because of the way our brains prioritise the neural pathways that get used most and ignore the ones that don't get used.... P became increasingly dominant in your brain function. You know all this, though... right? Sensitisation... desensitisation.... hypofrontality etc. The fact that you became dependent on an addictive brain chemical doesn't make you any less worthy of respect, love and affection than everybody else.

Like you, I'm finding it incredibly difficult to be assertive, because in my own shame-filled, head, I don't deserve a leg to stand on. I always feel guilty inside, which sounds like what you're saying. And the inability to be appropriately assertive can make me resentful, bitter and prone to being an ass-hat, which again sounds like the way you feel.

My post is too long and becoming self-centred, so I'll get to the point. Your post reminded me of day-1 in residential therapy. You deserve love, empathy and respect. You've had an illness that you're trying to heal. Once you stop using your drug (P in our case), you need to try to work through the reasons you were using P and try to find other ways of dealing with those sources of discomfort. As you make that journey, you may continue to feel regret but you will hopefully stop feeling shame. You have no reason to feel shame while you're fighting to live the healthier life you want to. Once you've been able to reduce the feelings of shame, you might find a way to express your wants and needs with more assertiveness, which could reduce your feelings of bitterness and resentment. Just being here today and staying clean is a good thing you can do to evolve a happier life. There are loads of books and websites that tell this story much more eloquently and usefully than I do. Are you doing any study or therapy to help yourself to manage those negative emotions and thoughts?

Just my thoughts. You don't have to do anything with them. Please feel free to ignore if I've typed a crock of shit.

 

[idunno]

Thanks WIP, your crock of shit is great and I appreciate it all. Thanks for fleshing the thoughts out the way you have. You're right it's about guilt, and low self esteem. I'm not involved in study, but I might explore some of the material.

It's easy for me to minimize the porn issue, or more to the point to forget the fact that I'm in the midst of trying to make a really significant change in my life by quitting porn. Remembering that fact, maybe I'll be able to give myself a break more. And give others a break, because I get nastily critical of people around me, too. These days I feel paranoid and mistrustful in all directions. Not at peace at all.

With the guilt, it's like I feel I'm a contemptible wretch (regardless of the fact I'm not!). So whenever anyone in an actual or imagined way slights me or makes me feel small, I get enraged. Somehow I feel they're right, that they've correctly named things. I get incensed. Porn has increased the dynamic significantly, but I also grew up with a sort of externally enforced inability to defend myself, starting right with my dad. He was severely dominating, and then would get scornful, angry, and verbally abusive whenever I tried to assert myself. I'm pretty sure he had a porn thing, too. I knew about his stashes, and was always really embarrassed by his plain-as-day oggling of women's asses. God it was embarrassing. But anyway, even feeling dominated by someone, and not necessarily insulted, is enough to set off this chain reaction of feelings in me. It's hard to explain.

I go out about my business and errands today, and feel pretty defeated. But hopefully I'm still moving forward, just by virtue of not using porn and not going bonkers.

 

[idunno]

81 days today. A few months ago when I saw someone mention 90 days, it seemed like an accomplishment out of reach. But now I'm almost there. I haven't looked at any porn. I've masturbated a handful of times (I'm fine with that), but kept a watch on my fantasies. Almost all my fantasies have their origins in porn, after all. The key for me, the most important thing, is no porn.

Sexual relations with my wife have been better, and it doesn't feel like the dangerous territory it felt like earlier. Before, it was like sex was straddling a wall -- my wife and our relations on one side, and porn, porn, and more porn on the other. I knew she didn't know about that other side, so being with her made me anxious, I think. With porn use, any non-porn arousal is threatening, since it brings up this other, hidden aspect that I want to keep hidden.

In the past few days, I've found myself remembering elements from porn at random moments -- performers, scenes, etc. -- that I haven't thought much about since quitting. It's strange, because when I remember them it's like it was just yesterday. Not much of an intervening distance in my psyche. But that's OK. I can't pretend it's just a clean break. Porn was a serious hobby of mine, so it's not going to just evaporate without some sort of reconciliation. I'm holding myself accountable for my actions, and I'm trying to lay off blaming myself for internal things.

I'm still fairly cranky and dissatisfied, but that's me. I've got my sense of humor, and whatever person I end up being in 3,6, or 12 months (and further) will just be another person (another unique spirit, or another schmuck, however you look at it!), but one who doesn't use porn, God willing! Hopefully all that focus, all the creativity that got poured into fantasy, and all that exertion (LOL) will get channeled into something else, eventually. But even if it doesn't I'm better off.

 

[idunno]

One thing I noticed today, seeing several really attractive women (moms of young kids) at this nature museum I was at with my kids. I see them, I notice them, I'm struck by them somehow, but I don't care nearly as much as I did a few months ago. I'm used to having this little surge of anxiety when I'd see a woman -- her hair, shoulder, leg, whatever. It was a feeling of danger. My porn imagination would get activated out in public, I guess, and it would make me nervous, like I was going to get noticed or something. I even felt that women could read my thoughts at times. But today, and lately, I just notice women and it passes, no big deal. I don't really care if they notice a glance. I'm not leering, and a glance these days is not a porthole into some pornographic universe, like it used to be.

Porn was like a toxic part of my imagination that I would look forward to entering, whenever I had free time, or even in my own mind if I was lying down and relaxing. Now, sometimes, especially if I'm lying down for a few minutes, I'll notice my mind scanning for that "interesting" place, before I even realize what it's looking for. It's like a child, rummaging around in an attic for a toy or something fun they remember. But it's not there anymore. There's no question that if I sat myself down before a porn website, I'd go whole-hog right back into that world. But in those moments when I realize what my mind's doing -- that rummaging around for something it remembers (almost subconsciously) -- I feel a little sad. I feel the loss of something I really enjoyed, even if it was harmful and hurtful to me and others. I realize then that my mind's looking for something it won't find, and it's a bit of an empty feeling.

I would love it if I ever found a "subconscious substitute" for porn -- something my mind found pleasurable enough to seek out on its own. The way the mind goes when daydreaming. But something beneficial, social, and constructive. Maybe that's too much to ask for, I don't know.

I think I'm fortunate to be a stay-at-home dad with little time to myself. If I were going on trips, staying at hotels, like many of the people on the forum, it would be a lot harder I know.

 

[bob]

Insightful words from someone moving in the right direction. I also have those  thoughts and feelings of loss of something that was such a big part of my life.

I have not given up on the idea of a substitute

Sounds like you are moving in the right direction.

 

[J01]

Here is a quote from your last post:

"I would love it if I ever found a "subconscious substitute" for porn -- something my mind found pleasurable enough to seek out on its own. The way the mind goes when daydreaming. But something beneficial, social, and constructive. Maybe that's too much to ask for, I don't know."

In your initial post or so you mentioned some disappointment concerning your academic field of study.  Is it possible that you could now seek a mini-revival in that regard, now that you have freed up some significant time?  Maybe you could work an article or do a little on the side consulting, volunteering,  or something of that nature and slowly get back in the game.  Obviously you cant do it full-time with your current responsibilities, but maybe you have thrown in the towel too early.  Kids aren't little for ever you know!     

 

[idunno]

Thanks jixu and bob. I was away at a national park, and have had family visiting. I would indeed like to get something going along the lines of what you mention, jixu. I'll soon have the time to think more about it, with both girls in school. I need some increased powers of imagination, I think. As it is I tend to think I don't have much to offer. Partly that's an effect of the way the job market works, where interviewers looks at you with skepticism (I feel), and you're in this ridiculous position of tooting your own horn for every little thing you've done. The other part's a self-esteem issue, and having been a truly dedicated porn addict for so long hasn't helped that. So, I hope to work on that "substitute." Yes, and "slowly get back in the game."

107 days now. It's nice when I forget to check it for a while, and say wow, it's getting up there. At the same time, I feel bombarded by urges, and I miss the experience. As someone aptly said in one post, the "awesome dopamine surge" or something like that. I mean, those of us who've been captivated to this degree by porn know the power of that experience. It's a hard thing to let go of, and doing so leaves me feeling like I'm floundering about a bit. Porn was a real anchor, in a way. Or I used it as such. Especially in times of anxiety, as others have said, too. And now I'm without it. Online triggers are less an issue for me than daily real-life glimpses of women. Those glimpses make the doors of the abyss want to open. Like someone's knocking on those doors. My answer, I guess, is to accept boredom and unease.

I want to write more but it'll have to wait. I'm wearied from just writing this, and need to focus elsewhere for the moment. Thank you everyone for your support and your journals, I wish you patience and calm.

 

[idunno]

Feeling the pull of porn these past few days. Sometimes, it's like I can feel my mind preparing for some sort of really devious logic. Yesterday in a still moment I found myself picturing my mind as divided into compartments or zones, 2 main ones. The largest was my non-porn using brain, i.e. it represented my current effort. It was encompassed by a border, and outside that border was the smaller second compartment, which was some sort of "exception" zone where I could look at porn without consequence, without it affecting the no-porn part. My imagination was trying to convince me I could engage in porn without actually impacting the "recovery" process. I recognized it, and knew it was B.S., so that's good, but it surprised me the way my mind came up with this image by itself, almost like I was dreaming or day-dreaming. Almost like the porn thinks for itself within my mind. Like it has its own machinations or like it can arrange my thoughts. Strange, but that's how it went.

 

[idunno]

I had a dream about a porn performer last night. We knew each other well, and she was going with me on a camping trip or something. It was just talk and mundane trip planning in the dream, but the promise of sexual fulfillment was right there under the surface. I really want to feel that level of excitement and dopamine now.

I went to the store this morning, and saw a couple women there that absolutely made me want to cry into my shopping basket. Biting-my-lip kind of stuff. Porn provides a level of excitement -- chasing down search terms, getting ideas for new ones, following new "leads," etc. And all the while I'm lit up with lust and my heart's racing. Kindling that kind of excitement, that's what I find myself wanting to do this morning.

Then again, I could wash out my dishwasher, which has had an off smell recently. I could plan what to cook tonight. I could clean the house a bit. Mow the lawn.

Maybe one day I'll get to the point where these moments of excitement will get more productively channeled. For almost all my life, the moments have tended to grow into a conflagration, a fever-pitch of compulsive behavior. It's like going into a trance. I wonder at times if part of a deeper lure of porn, if there is one, is my wanting to be completely overcome by something.

 

[Lero]

I feel you, man. I can't say I can't relate to some of the things you've said. I had a dream once about a porn scene. All day I had tried to ignore it because I was dying to watch it and it kept coming to my head. Then I dreamed exactly about watching this scene but I woke up right after, feeling so turned on, as if I was in front of the computer actually watching the scene. I barely survived. I had this unbearable urge to start edging to the flashback of that dream. I painfully rescued myself from there, I don't even know how I managed to do it.

 

[bob]

I wonder at times if part of a deeper lure of porn, if there is one, is my wanting to be completely overcome by something.

You think my thoughts.

My wife asked me about the level of excitement that I get from this stuff. All I could say is that its like morphine to her. She is not an addict, not even close but she has had morphine enough to know it would be her "drug of choice." Her comments, "that stuff was amazing."

Yeah, its like that.