First time rebooting-sex with spouse OK?

[celticpunk]

Hi all,

I'm just joining this community after coming to terms with my addiction. I'm 39, married with a beautiful son and I don't want to lose it all so I'm taking action before things really get worse. I'm almost two days sober now after a binge that could have easily resulted in severe consequences. I planning to eliminate all P and M, but wondered if folks think initiating sex with my wife this weekend might trigger a need for a "chaser" as I've read about. Thoughts? I'm also worried for this coming Sunday as I will be alone at the house for a few hours and have not yet been able to install K9 on the computer and throw out some old DVDs, books and mags I have hidden away, which I know could just send me into a spiral...

 

[Yelashade]

Hi celticpunk,

Welcome to the forum! I would suggest that you abstain from P, M and O - for a short while at least - before you consider trying actual sex. Your brain needs to refresh and reboot first before you can engage in intimacy. Try and keep yourself distracted with things like exercising, sport, taking your lady out to dinner, spending time with your son etc. Eventually, your inner mind will accept that there is more to life than the harem in front of your computer screen.

Good luck!

 

[OSS]

Do you have erectile dysfunction?

Definitely stay away from P and M as yelashade suggested if you do have erectile dysfunction. But if you don't have erectile dysfunction I see no good reason to not have sex, even if you do have erectile dysfunction I still see no good reason to avoid sexual contact with your wife. Many things in this reboot are individualized and orgasms are a big individual issue, if you orgasm and notice a strong chaser for porn, poor energy, poor libido, worse erection the same day and days after then it would be best to avoid orgasm. Even then you could still probably have sex just stop before orgasm.

Gauge your own progress and your own methods, but there's 1 variable that will never change and that is no porn.

Do you have to stay at the house alone? You could go out for those few hours and then throw away your stash when your wife is home to prevent you from binging.

 

[Fappy]

Hi mate,
Sex or sexual touching, various insertions, oral stimulation etc etc can be very therapeutic to the recovery process. If your partner understands your problem and what you need to do to repair it, then sex can boost the reboot.
Maybe its best not to expect immediate results but you and your partner will see an improvement which would be great. Just relax and enjoy the reboot! (Also enjoy your wife)

 

[challenged]

I [am] planning to eliminate all P and M, but wondered if folks think initiating sex with my wife this weekend might trigger a need for a "chaser" as I've read about. Thoughts?

I think there is somewhat of a tradeoff.  I think that sex with one's spouse can be helpful in rebuilding the pathways that involve sex with a real person, while at the same time reducing the urge to use porn and shutting down those "porn pathways."  So I personally think it can be very beneficial to the rebooting process.  At the same time, I think the "chaser effect" has to be acknowledged as something that is likely to be an issue for most rebooters.  It is likely to happen after sex.  So this is something that could increase the temptation to use porn in the next couple of days after sex.

For me, I resolved this conflict by having sex with my wife, but recognizing that I was going to experience the "chaser effect" and committing not to let it turn me back to porn.  Once I recognized that the effect was going to occur, and that it was only temporary, it was easier to deal with.  In addition, I noticed that the farther along I got in the rebooting process, the less the "chaser effect" gave me a desire to use porn.

 

[indiana]

I think what Challenger said about recognizing that there will be a chaser is very important. Be aware of that going into it and prepare to move through it.

Good luck brother, glad your'e here
Indiana.

 

[Mbg]

I wondered the same thing going into this.  We all have our own stories and experiences so I will try to stick to my story, but for me I have admitted in my recovery that my addiction goes beyond pixels and masturbation.  Throughout the years I've use sex, along with masturbation, in an unhealthy or addictive manner.  I have inadvertently objectified women whom I cared for.  I've pressured women into sex using manipulation or taking advantage of an opportunity.  I have taken risks having unprotected sex with women I barely knew.  Throughout my life, I have convoluted the terms sex, love, and intimacy without recognizing how different they are.  My point: early on the path to recovery, I never realized how deep my addiction was and that sex had also become a problem for me.  Taking a period of abstinence definitely helped me to realize how addicted I was.  If you have just started your reboot and are already concerned about sex it may be possible sex is another compulsive habit for you.  These are just my thoughts. If you feel inclined.  Go to saa.org and take the personal evaluation. 

 

[sender]

I know this sounds crazy to some people, but you can have sex with your wife without orgasms.  That's how you can have sex without the chaser.  And I have found that sex this way builds intimacy.  In my experience, I only really want the orgasms after having had some recently.  After some weeks of sex without orgasm, then I actually prefer it that way.  Pleasure is greater, sessions are more frequent and much longer and sweeter, we get along better; lots of benefits.

I saw [part of] a kind of stupid movie: Bad Johnson, but it actually has a pretty interesting idea at the core: what would happen if a man's penis was separated from his body as like a whole separate persona.  It captures how I often feel in that I'm of two minds.  One (my dick) is only thinking about taking physical pleasure, beauty, body, shape, genitalia, friction, orgasm.  The other (my heart) is interested in connection, love, intimacy, gazing into her eyes, touching her gently, bonding.  The movie also captures the feeling I have around needing to choose one or the other of these approaches.  In the movie, the guy isn't given a choice, but in my case, the choice is there every moment. 

I wouldn't recommend trying sex without orgasms without some guidance; otherwise, you might conclude prematurely that it's just a bad idea.  My wife and I found the book "Cupid's Poisoned Arrow" to be really helpful in that regard.  It explains a lot of the biological underpinnings of these things so that we could understand how it works, and why we would want to do that.  The author runs a forum at http://reuniting.info which explains a lot too, and you can find many posts there from people who are using those techniques.

Whatever you choose to do, quitting porn is the #1 thing.  But you don't have to stop there...without porn narrowing the focus down to a single point, the territory available for sexual creativity and exploration is vast. 

 

[celticpunk]

Thanks to all who responded to my question. The responses were really helpful. As it turns out, my wife was sick and we weren't able to have sex anyways. In some ways this is good, as I'm now about half way through day five of no PMO. I also made it through two stretches this weekend when I was alone in the house while my son was napping. Avoided all PMO and even managed to throw away some dvds, mags and a few nude photography books still lingering in the house. This was both liberating and kind of sad in a twisted way. Like saying goodbye to an old crutch...I'm really hoping to make it through the upcoming work week PMO free. So grateful to have the support and advice from this community. Best to all working toward a better life!

 

[tostadora]

I [am] planning to eliminate all P and M, but wondered if folks think initiating sex with my wife this weekend might trigger a need for a "chaser" as I've read about. Thoughts?

I think there is somewhat of a tradeoff.  I think that sex with one's spouse can be helpful in rebuilding the pathways that involve sex with a real person, while at the same time reducing the urge to use porn and shutting down those "porn pathways."  So I personally think it can be very beneficial to the rebooting process.  At the same time, I think the "chaser effect" has to be acknowledged as something that is likely to be an issue for most rebooters.  It is likely to happen after sex.  So this is something that could increase the temptation to use porn in the next couple of days after sex.

For me, I resolved this conflict by having sex with my wife, but recognizing that I was going to experience the "chaser effect" and committing not to let it turn me back to porn.  Once I recognized that the effect was going to occur, and that it was only temporary, it was easier to deal with.  In addition, I noticed that the farther along I got in the rebooting process, the less the "chaser effect" gave me a desire to use porn.

Challenged,

can you please elaborate on your experience rebooting with actual sex? How many days have you managed to stay away from PMO? When did the "chaser effect" start to dissipate?

I find myself now in a stable relationship with a girl and have been wondering how it's going to affect my reboot try (20 days now and counting). I was considering telling her to abstain from sex for a couple of months, but after reading this post I'm thinking differently.

Also, I suffer from delayed eyaculation, so I'm not able to experience orgasm when having sex with her. I assume that addiction-wise this is a good thing in order to level and rebalance dopamine in the brain.

Thanks!

 

[challenged]

Challenged,

can you please elaborate on your experience rebooting with actual sex? How many days have you managed to stay away from PMO? When did the "chaser effect" start to dissipate?

My last PMO episode was 35 days ago.  Prior to that time, and since I started the rebooting process in early October, I had substantially reduced the frequency and durations of my use of porn.  Probably about 75% in terms of a reduction in both frequency and duration, with fairly large gaps in between any use of porn.  Also, the results of my rebooting have been somewhat different than others.  I have had no withdrawal symptoms, and my PIED was resolved very quickly, probably in less than two weeks of staying away from porn.

I'll give you my current opinion on the "chaser effect" dissipating.  I'm not sure if in one sense the effect is ever going to dissipate, as I tend to believe that the "chaser effect" from O with a real person might just be the natural after-effect of IRL sex, which involves physical, emotional and spiritual components, particularly when one has been married to the same person for a long time.  My experience for most of my married life is that the day or two after sex with my wife, we feel very close to one another, and I seem to have an increase in sexual desire and arousal, and a desire for more sex with her.  My wife has commented that she feels the same way. 

I think what does diminish over time in the course of the rebooting process is the desire to express or satisfy this desire or arousal by M or looking at porn.  So I think that is why the "chaser effect" is problematic for porn users who are rebooting -- their natural inclination whenever they feel a strong desire for sexual stimulation is to turn to porn.  My experience is that, during the rebooting process as your brain rewires, the "chaser effect" after sex tends to push one towards having another sexual experience with your partner, rather than porn. 

So when I experience the "chaser effect" now, I direct my feelings towards my wife, as opposed to porn.  But again, I think the feelings of desire, arousal, etc. that one gets 1-3 days after sex with a real person are the natural result of healthy sex, and are likely to persist, particularly if one is having rewarding sex in a loving relationship.

I hope that makes sense, and it's just my opinion.  And YMMV, as they say.

 

[tostadora]

Yeah, that really helps me understand what it's going on. The other day I felt really horny, as part of my sustained abstinence from porn, and was triggered by almost any girl I saw. After having sex with my gf, and not having an orgasm, I felt relieved, and I was scared that the response was similar to porn.

 

[HumbleRich]

K9 works great overall, but I have found that there are a few issues with it.  1.  Obviously, you can access it whenever if you have the password and simply turn K9 off, act out, and then turn it back on again.  Even if you put in a password that is intentionally impossible to remember, you can always click "forgot password" and get a temporary one from your email.  Virtually the only way to porn-free your computer (if you are doing it by yourself) is to use an impossible to remember password and link your K9 to an email account purposefully selected for this task, to which you also create an impossible password. 

DO NOT DO THIS!!!  I did with one computer (fortunately one which I barely used) and was screwed when I found out it was blocking legitimate websites I wanted to use.

Easiest thing you can do is to have your wife set up your K9 account, have her create the password and link it to her email account.  That way you are locked out and cannot "cheat", unless, of course, you log into her email, which would be an extreme thing to do.  This assumes, of course, that she is aware of your addiction and recovery.

The second issue: what if you want to look up sex positions, or do something legitimate that is related to sex?  Something that your wife supports as part of your relationship.  K9 will block everything sex related unless you specifically tell it to ignore particular sites.  If, as mentioned above, your wife is in control of your K9, she could tell it to ignore certain sexual health sites or whatever.

On the other hand, you could always PMO to these non-porn sites, so I'm not sure about the answer to this issue...

Overall, K9 does a good job.  I recommend it.