MrCicero's Big Audacious Reboot | A story and commitment

Gambit123

Active Member
Just thought id drop you a note. I am 32, very similar story to your life. Lots of faied opportumities followed by cialis dependent sex. I discoveted ybop in nov and on that day i started my reboot. Keep going. We arw going to beat this.ww can do be a success story just like the hindreds on ybop.
 

mrcicero

Member
remington81 said:
Stay strong....just came out of mine! It will pass it's like the storm before the calm (backwards right...lol) but it's working! Keep writing! I find that helps me a lot brother! 100

Hey Remington, thanks for the nice words.  And sorry for the delay in getting back. I haven't journaled in a couple days, given that I seem to be in a good place without a lot of change.
So, are you saying you just got out of the flatline? How did you know, and what is that like? You have my full attention.

Cicero
 

mrcicero

Member
lapdog said:
Hey Cicero, I joined the forum yesterday and have been replacing normal PMO time with reading about other's experiences. Feeling a great relief to know there are other guys out there with such similar experiences. I wanted to say I really appreciate your thoughtfulness and diligence in your journal keeping. I'm in Day 2 of no PMO and really want to use the journaling practice to help heal. I've always found that intellectual stimulation and quantifying my progress has helped me through any challenge in my life. This one is particularly daunting because of the nature of addiction and the shameful aspects of a PMO addiction in particular. In any case, I can't tell you how inspirational your posts are--even the ones you admit being depressed in. Keep up the hard work.

Hi Lapdog, thanks very much for saying what you did, and I'm glad to see that my writing has helped someone else. Apologies for the delay, as I haven't been on in a few days. You were on Day 2 when you posted, so now you must be around Day 5.  For me the first week was definitely the hardest, and all of the sudden in got a lot easier. As you long as you push through this week, the probability of your relapsing goes down significantly.
Incidentally, I'm much like you in that the intellectual focus on this seems to help me. The biggest thing that helped me, though, was finding YBOP on Day 0 and realizing instantly, without hesitation or looking  back, that I would never look at porn or fap again. After my first week, I found the urges mostly went away. Yes, the flatline hasn't been rewarding and there have been a few depressive moments, but all in all I'm calmly confident in my progress and also confident that this was easily one of the best decisions I have made, ever.
Keep posting and I'll look for your journal entries. Best of luck to you.

Cicero
 

mrcicero

Member
Gambit123 said:
Just thought id drop you a note. I am 32, very similar story to your life. Lots of faied opportumities followed by cialis dependent sex. I discoveted ybop in nov and on that day i started my reboot. Keep going. We arw going to beat this.ww can do be a success story just like the hindreds on ybop.

Thanks Gambit. I really appreciated the note. If you've been doing this since Nov, it means you've abstained now for about 4 months.  Hope you've found some benefit from this Hard 90 and from the new habits you've picked up. I'm hoping to be where you are soon enough.
Please stay in touch.
Cicero
 

mrcicero

Member
Day 33 of My Reboot -- Good mood lately; expectations after the flatline; Passed the 30 day mark!!
Mood Score: 7

+++

I haven't journaled in a few days, mostly because I've felt pretty decent but also because I haven't experienced much change. I finished my business trip on Wed and have had some family in town since then, so it's been busy. My mood has been pretty decent, but I still feel flatlined. I had a hint of blue balls on Thurs, which actually made me feel happy because it made me think that I might be getting some spontaneous activity back.

Something else I've been thinking about is that I'm not sure I actually understand the flatline. What I mean is that I had this expectation that once I got over the porn and the fapping, I would have this sort of super-charged sexual always-on power in real life.  At the moment I don't feel that, which is why I'm calling it flatline.  I'm not sure if this expectation was correct or not. On the one hand, I read a compelling argument somewhere on YBOP that real sex is meant to be with a real life person, so when not in the presence of a real life person the sex circuitry should be switched off; that makes sense and explains the flatline. On the other hand, other guys have written that once they unhooked from the porn after the Hard 90, they started getting much more turned on by women everyday, even outside of sexual experiences (i.e., "spontaneous erections"). I'm assuming, though I don't know for sure, that both are normal, as guys are undoubtedly different. But I'm not positive. I'm fine with whatever at the moment, as I've enjoyed the process thus far, and I have another ~60 days to go.

On a final note, I passed the 30 Day mark... that's an incredible achievement and it feels great! Onward and upward!

Cicero
 

lapdog

Member
Congrats on hitting the 30 day mark and for the private message. I'm now on day 7 (thank goodness) but am looking forward to when I can say confidently I've made 30 days. I too have a question about the flatline. I've gone no PMO before up to a month and had basically the same experience you are now having. It's interesting how our notions of sex and sexuality are all jumbled because of the addiction. We expect to be super charged sexual creatures after rebooting, but I think that might be the lingering effects of the constant over-stimulation for our years in front of the screen. I don't know.
 

mrcicero

Member
lapdog said:
It's interesting how our notions of sex and sexuality are all jumbled because of the addiction. We expect to be super charged sexual creatures after rebooting,....I don't know.
Yeah, I don't know either. I can't say I know what to expect. But... if the flatline is all there is left, then there is a huge philosophical shift that needs to take place in my mind.  The shift basically is to stop thinking about attaining fulfillment from sex. Maybe life is "supposed" to feel this way: you think of sex when going to have sex, otherwise there is "flatline". Maybe there is analogy here with work -- some people think they need to find deep meaning in the work they do, and they strive for better and better jobs thinking they'll find fulfillment and happiness, when in reality fulfillment comes much from within and won't be satisfied by work itself. What if that same thing applies to sex? That means that all that chasing of sex/porn to fill the void of fulfillment is artificial, and there is no real fulfillment from sex alone, or from anything.  There is life and "now" and being, and then there are the things you do: eat, work, play, have sex. Those are all activities you do, but none of them are supposed to take all your time or energy and none of them really create fulfillment by themselves. It's weird to think about it that way, when having been hooked on porn you basically think in an entirely sexual way.

I don't know if I'm right. If you think about it long enough, you could render yourself paranoid!

Cicero
 

mrcicero

Member
Day 35 of My Reboot -- Philosophical shift on flatline may be in order, but not sure
Mood Score: 7

+++

I'm on a business trip again, and another day is almost done -- hooray for no fapping and no porn. I feel pretty good - not much stress and handling the business day well.

Instead of writing a new journal entry, I'm going to paste in here what I just wrote in reply to Lapdog. I don't know whether I have the right thinking about the flatline.  But it begs some basic philosophical questions about what we expect to attain from having sex, other than having fun.  Porn seems to find a way in providing some false sense of fulfillment, and in porn's absence real sex doesn't necessarily provide that. Real sex is fun, but, like other activities, it doesn't create complete fulfillment in and of itself. Dealing with finding new ways to find fulfillment, and finding fulfillment itself, is the subject of this philosophical shift:

<paste>

I can't say I know what to expect. But... if the flatline is all there is left, then there is a huge philosophical shift that needs to take place in my mind.  The shift basically is to stop thinking about attaining fulfillment from sex. Maybe life is "supposed" to feel this way: you think of sex when going to have sex, otherwise there is "flatline". Maybe there is analogy here with work -- some people think they need to find deep meaning in the work they do, and they strive for better and better jobs thinking they'll find fulfillment and happiness, when in reality fulfillment comes much from within and won't be satisfied by work itself. What if that same thing applies to sex? That means that all that chasing of sex/porn to fill the void of fulfillment is artificial, and there is no real fulfillment from sex alone, or from anything.  There is life and "now" and being, and then there are the things you do: eat, work, play, have sex. Those are all activities you do, but none of them are supposed to take all your time or energy and none of them really create fulfillment by themselves. It's weird to think about it that way, when having been hooked on porn you basically think in an entirely sexual way.

I don't know if I'm right. If you think about it long enough, you could render yourself paranoid!
 
Cicero:

Sorry I'm late too brother! Yes when I came out I KNEW because as I stated, I'm not a negative or down person EVER. And I couldn't shake these thoughts of "im not enough" "life isn't worth it" "my gf is cheating" look at how I was talking in my journal. Then one day I woke up and felt "different" no physically but mentally. Like I felt like all the  stuff I had  been listening too (self help books) just kicked in! I truly think the cold showers helped move the flatline along. Again listen to the ted talk on them! It teaches you confidence. Just keep walking bro! As long as you aren't watching P, everyday is a victory!!

 

pinkerton

Well-Known Member
Hey Cicero congrats on all your progress, sounds awesome. I think you're on to something with your philosophical shift. I think I expect sex to give the same fulfillment that pmo did but without the guilt, shame, and hangover afterwards. But it doesn't. It is just sex. It's fun and feels good and most importantly brings us children. Wow, I just thought of that. The best things and most fulfillment I ever got from sex is my kids. I always think about pleasure as the point of sex. But really, that's just a nice side effect. I've had it backwards for my whole life.
 

Gwynbleidd

Member
mrcicero said:
I can't say I know what to expect. But... if the flatline is all there is left, then there is a huge philosophical shift that needs to take place in my mind.  The shift basically is to stop thinking about attaining fulfillment from sex. Maybe life is "supposed" to feel this way: you think of sex when going to have sex, otherwise there is "flatline". Maybe there is analogy here with work -- some people think they need to find deep meaning in the work they do, and they strive for better and better jobs thinking they'll find fulfillment and happiness, when in reality fulfillment comes much from within and won't be satisfied by work itself. What if that same thing applies to sex? That means that all that chasing of sex/porn to fill the void of fulfillment is artificial, and there is no real fulfillment from sex alone, or from anything.  There is life and "now" and being, and then there are the things you do: eat, work, play, have sex. Those are all activities you do, but none of them are supposed to take all your time or energy and none of them really create fulfillment by themselves. It's weird to think about it that way, when having been hooked on porn you basically think in an entirely sexual way.

I don't know if I'm right. If you think about it long enough, you could render yourself paranoid!


Yes, I think this is correct. If one had 10 sport cars, 15 mansions all over the world, a harem full of women in all nationalities and forms he still wouldn?t be fulfilled. For example many rap/rock stars are throwing their lifes away on women and drugs because there is nothing to gain anymore then numbness. Or many people who grew up rich can not appreciate what they have. Or just grew up in a good society (western world). I really do appreciate that I have all my ten fingers, funtctionable eyes, a nose (a little bit big one :) ) and so on. Life goes up and down, up and down. The way I see it is you work, you achieve something and you can enjoy it more than you would if it was given to you for zero effort. You take a break, go on vacation and you can enjoy it thankfully after hard work. You fought for something and got it in the end, you will appreciate it and it fulfills you for some time (There is a good movie on that subject "Vanilla Sky", even though I dont like the main actor). For example I have chosen pickup for now, approaching random girls, attract them and bring them back home to her or my place. It was not easy for me because I had to work on so many things, confidence, being more alpha, more talkative to name a few. But when I am getting success I can really enjoy it because I worked for it and I feel deep fulfillment in the moment. I know many people consider this as stupid and I can understand that. Most want to get married and have a few kids and a stable job and this is perfectly fine, I am not judging. But it?s the way I choose for me because I have to work constantly on myself and for me its a real success. No dating sites, no f....... apps because you will get rewarded for almost doing nothing. I want to be challenged. That said its only one thing in a life. You can work on many areas and accomplish a lot. Life is changing constantly and you cannot be fulfilled 24/7. One has to decide what he/she wants to get out of life. Hamburger or Salad, Playstation or Jogging, TV or reading, ED or reboot, get kicked or kicking asses :) I am a very extreme guy with high spikes and rock bottom lows - I think the most healthiest way is to find something in between without loosing passion.
 

mrcicero

Member
Hey Pinkerton,
Thanks for the response. I have to say... I never thought about the aspect of kids providing fulfillment, above sex. I really didn't. And I bet most people don't. That's really ingenious. You obviously understand exactly where I'm coming from, and you really turned it up a notch. Thank you.

Cicero

pinkerton said:
Hey Cicero congrats on all your progress, sounds awesome. I think you're on to something with your philosophical shift. I think I expect sex to give the same fulfillment that pmo did but without the guilt, shame, and hangover afterwards. But it doesn't. It is just sex. It's fun and feels good and most importantly brings us children. Wow, I just thought of that. The best things and most fulfillment I ever got from sex is my kids. I always think about pleasure as the point of sex. But really, that's just a nice side effect. I've had it backwards for my whole life.
 

mrcicero

Member
Gwynbleidd,
You got my meaning, and thanks that's another good perspective. You have a good example. I can chase all the cars and mansions out there, but they're not life and aren't fulfilling in and of themselves. I guess sex is the same way: it's not really fulfilling as an end goal. It's so weird to think of it this way, when for so long I seemed to be wired to think it was fulfilling -- and I didn't realize I was thinking of it that way.

When you realize that sex, or other pursuits, are just activities that aren't fulfilling in and of themselves, you start to wonder how to best fill your life outside of those activities. Pinkerton had a really smart answer for that one: spending time with your kids.

Gwynbleidd said:
Yes, I think this is correct. If one had 10 sport cars, 15 mansions all over the world, a harem full of women in all nationalities and forms he still wouldn?t be fulfilled. For example many rap/rock stars are throwing their lifes away on women and drugs because there is nothing to gain anymore then numbness. Or many people who grew up rich can not appreciate what they have. Or just grew up in a good society (western world). I really do appreciate that I have all my ten fingers, funtctionable eyes, a nose (a little bit big one :) ) and so on. Life goes up and down, up and down. The way I see it is you work, you achieve something and you can enjoy it more than you would if it was given to you for zero effort. You take a break, go on vacation and you can enjoy it thankfully after hard work. You fought for something and got it in the end, you will appreciate it and it fulfills you for some time (There is a good movie on that subject "Vanilla Sky", even though I dont like the main actor). For example I have chosen pickup for now, approaching random girls, attract them and bring them back home to her or my place. It was not easy for me because I had to work on so many things, confidence, being more alpha, more talkative to name a few. But when I am getting success I can really enjoy it because I worked for it and I feel deep fulfillment in the moment. I know many people consider this as stupid and I can understand that. Most want to get married and have a few kids and a stable job and this is perfectly fine, I am not judging. But it?s the way I choose for me because I have to work constantly on myself and for me its a real success. No dating sites, no f....... apps because you will get rewarded for almost doing nothing. I want to be challenged. That said its only one thing in a life. You can work on many areas and accomplish a lot. Life is changing constantly and you cannot be fulfilled 24/7. One has to decide what he/she wants to get out of life. Hamburger or Salad, Playstation or Jogging, TV or reading, ED or reboot, get kicked or kicking asses :) I am a very extreme guy with high spikes and rock bottom lows - I think the most healthiest way is to find something in between without loosing passion.
 

mrcicero

Member
Day 41 of My Reboot -- Feel like curling into a little ball; situation with girlfriend is my fault and I feel like a jerk; P.S. Not sure she cares...
Mood Score: 2  :(

+++

Excuse my language, but I feel like plain shit today. And it has nothing to do with this No PMO business. I got into a sort of bad situation with my girlfriend today. Actually it's worse. She's upset, disappointed with me, and sad, but not fighting nor really talking to me. Fighting is almost better; it's more painful to sit while someone, particularly someone you love, is sad because of you. I won't really get into it, but basically I was a bit of an a**hole, and it also is related to what may be some commitment issues on my part. We've been together now several years and it's getting to be time for me to take the next step. Anyway, I feel like curling up into a ball in the corner and disappearing for a while. If I could do some sort of penance to make it go away, I would.

The only mildly good news I have is that I in no way had any desire to go back to fapping today. I say this because a situation such as this one in the past might have caused me to go fap just to disappear from the issue for a while. Self-medication. I no longer have any desires to PMO, and real sex is the furthest thing from my mind today so breaking my No-PMO streak won't happen today. I feel like a jerk, but at least I'm proud of myself for not falling back on the old habit. Silver lining to today's situation?

I will say one more thing, since I'm using this space to personally vent today. I'm sharing this proud moment (i.e., not falling back on PMO) with you guys, but not my girlfriend. My girlfriend basically doesn't give a damn. When I started this Hard 90, I sat with her for almost 3 hours and explained the PMO addiction and the fapping. I didn't tell her exactly how often I did it, but I told her I did it and I told her the effect I believe it had on our relationship and on my body (the ED, etc.).  She listened and was supportive, but I asked her to flip through the YBOP website and the excellent PDF book on the site (which I bought and shared with her)... I didn't really expect her to read all of it, but she said she would and I thought she might spend an hour looking at it. But nothing. I guess I expect too much, but I'm disappointed. I mentioned it several times, to a vague response of "Sure I'll look, I said I would."  Sigh. It's cool that she's not judging me, but her reaction is really in the opposite direction of judgment, which not caring. I'm not sure what to think and if I'm overreacting.

I have to sign off and get some sleep. Business trip again tomorrow for the next three days.  I'll post again. Thanks for reading!

Cicero

 

Gwynbleidd

Member
I think you should talk to her. Express what you really feel. By the way this is one of the things people regret most when they are dying. (Express feelings and being honest)

I messed up so badly with my ex mainly because I didn?t talk to her, I didn?t tell her the truth and basically I didn?t care. That was the biggest mistake of them all and don?t care is the most hurtful thing. I don?t kow what you did but if she doesn?t care about your reboot that?s bad.

When my ex found that I was watching porn, man, this was awful for her. Maybe your girlfriend is feeling the same way. That she is not enough for you. But she does not express it. I think they don?t understand that it?s not (only) about other women but mainly because of addiction and dopamine.

Life is complex if we allow it to :)

All the best for you!
 
Man. Brother I relate to this post! My gf did the same thing bro...she didn't say ANYTHING. I spoke about it in my journal as well. Here's my advice brother:

FUCK IT! Excuse my language but I wanted it to be blunt! I stopped caring what she thinks! With or without Her this is my issue! She will really NEVER understand. Focus on healing! Show her better than you can tell her! My gf has made ONE positive statement throughout almost 50 days. I've been through hell and back, and I'm still here and so are you! Stay strong bro and stay focused..
 

mrcicero

Member
Guys, thank you for the feedback and the support. 
What Gambit123 said - "The right woman would be supportive" - is so simple, yet it hit me pretty hard. It's true. I think we get caught up in snags in relationships and miss certain basic truths, such as this one. Maybe we believe we don't deserve as much or will never get it.  But in the end, I would like to think that the right woman would be supportive.  It ties to something that Gwynbleidd wrote:

Gwynbleidd said:
When my ex found that I was watching porn, man, this was awful for her. Maybe your girlfriend is feeling the same way. That she is not enough for you. But she does not express it.

It's true that she might not express it. And in not expressing it, it comes across as not supportive. I've recently found a concept called "emotional honesty."  It's pretty common sense stuff: being honest about your feelings and emotions. But it's hard to do in practice. And we guys often assume that women are the ones who are emotionally expressive, which leads men to believe that if there is something not obviously wrong in a relationship, they're the ones who are the unemotional, unexpressive jerks who can't communicate. But I'm finding that, in fact, it takes two to tango, and women can be unexpressive (and consequently emotional dishonest) as well, which leads to a break down in communication and in feelings. Then the guy walks away thinking he was the cause, or not realizing anything at all and just chalking it up to incompatibility.

Anyway, you've hit on a spot for me that I've been researching over the last week, precisely related to what I wrote. That's all I'll say about the situation, but I think that this is what might be happening in my situation.

Thanks again guys-

Cicero
 

mrcicero

Member
Day 45 of My Reboot -- The Half-Way Mark!!!
Mood Score: 4

+++

Well gentlemen, I'm happy to say that I'm at my half-way point: Day 45.  Feels good to be here. When I started, I was so committed to this that I knew I would make it through. But at the same time, 45 days felt like a long way off.  And in some ways, it does feel like it was a long time ago when this started. I've accomplished so much in 45 days, and I've attained a great deal of slow but steady personal change. I don't know personally how long it will take to rewire my behaviors fully, but I appreciate the fact that they've been baked into my neural chemistry now for 20 years, so I'm patient with the process. I'm looking forward to change not just the fapping and the porn, but the hypersexualization, the focus on women, the objectifying, the over-expectation of dating, the under-fulfillment of my real needs, the low confidence I had with certain women.

Along with these items, I'm working to rewire my ingrained relationship and communication behaviors as well. (Some might call it "being more of a self-actualized man".)  Which ties into my other recent posts about my situation with my girlfriend. She came out of her hyper-angry state yesterday (when I came home from my business trip after being gone since this thing happened), which on the one hand feels good because the uncomfortable silence and anger are gone, but on the other hand I never really got a chance to deal with the communication problem and my (and her) emotional dishonesty rooted in the heart of our relationship. Now I'll have to bring the topic up, when she and I are ready, of my own volition. But that's part of the behavioral rewiring that I'm trying to incorporate into this overall rewiring process.  If I make some headway, I'll post about it in the future.

Anyway, I feel reasonably good.  In the free time that I've had from abstaining from the fapping, I've continued to take my online class that I mentioned in an early post, and I'm still meditating. I've changed subtly but steadily over 45 days, so I hope to continue experiencing positive change and evolution over the next 45, and I can't wait for what they'll bring.

Cheers all,
Cicero
 
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