20 years are enough (Arthur's journal)

[PhoenixRevival]

Hey arthur,
That mother of that kid sure had big impact it seems. You think if you MOd thinking about her that it might have prevented a relapse?
  I hope that you taking it as a learning experience to be applied for your new reboot. You are better prepared to face the tough days now!
I tend to believe that our past (childhood) and all really impacts our behaviour now.  For me, I was shy and maybe porn is my escape
at getting gorgeous babes. Never thought of it in this way until I read your post. One of the things that has been working for me till now is am trying to
become more self aware of my feelings at different moments of the day. I try to reflect on it each time, what i am feeling, what is causing that feeling
and what are the impacts of that feeling on my thoughts and my body. Being self aware is helping me cope. Yesteday I managed erase my porn collection,
6 clicks and it was all gone. Emptied recycle bin even. Felt improved afterwards. Also exercise. Watching Game of thrones does not help much though.

 

[arthur]

Thanks Phoenix. Congratulations on erasing your porn collection! That's a big, big step. I also think it's great that you manage to stay aware of what's going on in your mind and body. I'm trying to do this too, but I have to admit I find it exhausting and sooner or later discover that I've been on auto pilot for the past hours. I guess it's a question of practice.

Regarding the playdate's mother: I don't think MOing while fantasizing about her would have prevented the relapse. I think this whole objectifying women business, in whatever form (porn, voyeurism, fantasizing) has to stop.

(Lots of ramblings below. I've been writing this for myself mostly.)

I have started reading Breaking The Cycle -- actually, I'm half way through already. The part I've just read is exactly about what you mention: how childhood experiences, particularly what Collins calls the "original wound", influence our behavior for the rest of our lives (if we let them). I'm sure that in my case it's exactly as you describe it: that porn (or earlier, lingerie catalogs and the like, or just fantasies) allowed me to experience the intimacy I thought I could not experience with real people. I've known this for a long time, but I never thought it worthwhile to spend much time digging into it. The past is the past and all that. But I'm afraid the past for me is more present than I've been aware of.

I have an idea what my original wound might be. Until I was five years old, I was a happy child with slightly unusual interests: I enjoyed books with technical illustrations, or drawing intricate patterns. Things that might sound a bit autistic, but at the same time I enjoyed the company of other kids and made contact with them easily. But there was a kindergarten teacher who apparently did not approve of my strange ways: she mocked me every day in front of the other kids for being "different", singled me out, excluded me from the games the others played, etc. I have no memory at all of this (strangely), but my mother tells me that a few weeks in that kindergarten changed my personality completely. From happy and outgoing to extremely shy, self-conscious and more than borderline depressed. In fact, I was a five year old who repeatedly told his mom he did not want to live any more. My mom still blames herself that she didn't take me to a therapist back then.

Anyway, this feeling of being different in a shameful way has stayed with me ever since. I soon discovered that masturbation could help me push away these feelings for a few moments -- at the cost of feeling even more ashamed afterwards. The rest I described in my first post.

Collins writes to ask myself, "Am I ready to be who I was really meant to be, before the early wounding? What do I have to do to get there?". I can hardly believe it but in all these years, I've never asked myself this question. I always assumed that I would be emotionally and socially crippled for life. Of course I've made a lot of progress, but the wound seemed to define who I was as a person. Could this just be a story I've been telling myself?

 

[arthur]

As recommended by Collins, I've just written up a dialogue with my porn-loving sub-personality. I call him Sneaky. When I first read Collins' instructions for doing this, I was convinced that I would just make stuff up and it would be entirely futile. Until I tried. First in English, which didn't work, as expected. Then in my native language. And to my surprise, I didn't have to make stuff up. I paid attention to my impulses, and turning them into (Sneaky's) words was effortless and natural.

I've had my first conversation with Sneaky. It feels good. When he turns up again, instead of starting the web browser, I'll load up a text editor and talk to him. He said he'd be back.

 

[arthur]

Finished the Collins book. Did the exercises. Had a few more conversations (in writing) with my P subpersonality, Sneaky. Felt pretty sure I was on the right track.

And then, two days ago, Sneaky took over. He was absolutely in control. There was no part of me left that did not want to watch P. I couldn't have cared less about my counter. In fact, I was pretty sure I wouldn't even reset the counter, or mention the relapse here, if indeed I'd ever come back here at all.

Immediately after I O'd the desire for P was gone completely, and I deleted everything. But today, instead of working (at home), I watched P again for 5 hours. Arthur seemed to have no say in it, it was Sneaky all the way. After the O, again, I deleted everything.

I honestly can't say that I feel bad about it. I guess that means that I'm still part Sneaky.

I really don't know what I could do about relapses like this. I mean, I could take precautions beforehand so that I simply can't get P even if I want it. I've tried that, it never worked for long. For example, some time ago I switched my router over to a DNS server that blocked adult sites and set a random password so I wouldn't be able to switch back. After about a week I did a factory reset on the router (all you need is a paper clip), and the P was back.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

Hi arthur,
Hardest thing i believe is realising that one is an addict, so hardest part has been done.
Now all changes takes time I believe. According to few books I read, at least 21 days.
Your childhood story reminds me a little about mine. When I was a kid, my father humiliated me in public
and I had some humilitaion at school too with some teachers. All those events made me feel shameful and guilt
which maybe have led me to find refuge in porn in my adult life. I just MO'd and relapsed my MO counter.
Babe at work too damn hot. It is turning into an obsession. Also game of thrones not a good serie to watch.
I watched a video recently on this site about happiness, it was a tedx, u watched?
Am apllying the principles, that is
- Think of 3 things you are grateful about each day
- Journal a positive experience
- Meditation
- Exercise
- A random act of kindness.
Am doing these things every day, aim is to help you see the world in a positive manner.
I hope that seeing the world more positively releases me from shame, guilt and other anxieties and
helps me on no P.
P managed control you through Sneaky, when it wants to find a way, its hard to stop it. I realised that just now.
I thought about coming to site to stop myself, but urge was stronger. I should try that collins book you mentioning, what is its title?
Well this time arthur, I have a feeling you will smash your previous counter. good luck man!

 

[arthur]

?and again.

For the next week, I'm going to try the following rules:

• Try to be present and mindful all the time. Meditate every day.
• Drop some habits and distractions. For example, I have a feeling that browsing tech news sites numbs my mind. I ALWAYS do this before switching to P. Listening to podcasts or the radio while driving or working around the house makes it very hard to stay mindful. So, I have deleted the news reader and podcast player from my phone and computer, and my hope is that it might actually be quite liberating to be without this stuff.
• MO every day, if possible in the mornings. I hope this will ease the cravings. All my relapses were on days I hadn't MOd. I also think there's a chance it will make M (and by extension, P) less appealing by incorporating it into my daily routine (it will be like brushing my teeth?). If it doesn't work, I'll switch to not MOing at all for a week and see how that goes.

Also (and maybe more importantly), I've switched the router back to a porn-blocking DNS server. I'll set a random password again and give it to my wife to hide? along with the ISP's activation code, so a factory reset will leave me with no internet access at all. I'll tell her to give me a stern look and ask if I'm really, really sure should I ever ask for it back. I haven't told her about my attempt to quit P by the way. Or that I have a problem with P. However, she knows I watch P from time to time and am prone to procrastination, so I'm sure she's put two and two together.

@Phoenix: Your childhood really sounds similar to mine in that respect. I hope we'll both succeed in putting it behind us. (You sure seem to be more successful than me there!).

I looked but couldn't find the TEDx talk you mentioned. It sounds interesting though. You don't happen to have a link?

The book is called "Breaking the Cycle: Free Yourself from Sex Addiction, Porn Obsession, and Shame", by George Collins. I've seen it recommended here a few times.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

Hey buddy,
Good am not seeing you here, that means you more in control of urges.
Good luck man. I know you will be able make it this time!
Exercise, do anything else.. do something else that passionates you to replace the urge if it happens..
do it for at least 20 mins..

 

[arthur]

Thanks, Phoenix, I really appreciate it.

Regarding my DNS server plans, I guess I didn't want to see the incredibly obvious ways around it. Oh well, that would have been too easy, right?

 

[arthur]

So, that was my week-end home alone. PMO every day.

To put things in perspective, being home alone has always meant (P)MOing for me since I was about 12. I don't think there has been a single exception to this rule. Ever.

It's pretty obvious from my counter with its high number (and increasing frequency) of red numbers, that I'm not particularly successful at willing myself to stop looking at porn. Arguing with my P subpersonality Sneaky is kind of fun, but it's supposed to help me by making me see that Sneaky's arguments "pro P" are invalid, and as Sneaky has said himself: he doesn't need arguments. All he needs are my habits that have been reinforced over and over again for more than two decades, and a suitable situation.

I think I have to take a step back. I've read a little about "porn addiction" and stumbled upon a dissertation (http://digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1983&context=etd) that tried something called "Acceptance and Commitment Therapy" (ACT). It's one of the relatively new mindfulness-based approaches to psychotherapy. The dissertation reports very encouraging results, but unfortunately does not elaborate much on what actually happened in the therapy sessions. So I've picked up a self-help book by the founder of ACT ("Get Out of Your Mind & Into Your Life", Steven C. Hayes).

At first I was a little disappointed as it seems to be written more for people suffering from anxiety and depression than compulsive behavior. But now I think a change in perspective might help. I think that anxiety, particularly fear of failure, is a major factor behind my compulsive P use. Thinking back to the past few days, I was at the computer wanting to work on my PhD project. I don't think there currently is anything more anxiety-laden in my life. It's my third attempt at getting a PhD. The first two were really just lofty ideas that never went anywhere, I hadn't even bothered to look for a supervisor. Now I do have supervision (an attractive young female professor, I don't think that's unimportant?) and the project is well within my capacities, so I actually have to work on it. I tried to feel my fear of failing, of making mistakes, of looking stupid in front of my supervisor? but I couldn't. I'm so used to avoiding these fears that I can't feel them. One major avoidance strategy is, of course, P. I pretty consistently switch to P after finishing one work package, particularly if the next one might be problematic. Rather than experiencing the uncertainty and fear associated with that, I go to a P site. I'm already at the computer anyway, and haven't I earned it for the work I've done?

So rather than focusing on not looking at P, my project for the next few days is to try to experience my fear of failure. I try to stay mindful pretty much all the time. No distractions. I have installed a mindfulness bell on my phone that reminds me of being mindful every 15 minutes or so. It's quite blissful to be in this state when I'm not at the computer. I enjoyed the "away from keyboard" part of yesterday tremendously, even chores I usually hate. But the computer always pulls me in, even if I actually work instead of watching P. For a few hours yesterday afternoon, I didn't even notice the mindfulness bell.

So: mindful computing. Addressing the security blanket aspect of P rather than P itself. If the urge comes, I will try to be present for it too (I don't usually when I'm at the computer, I try to suppress it until it's suddenly in control).

Oh, and a side note: MOing to lessen the urge did not seem work for me this week-end. At all. One day I MOd twice within an hour, and half an hour later I was at the computer watching P.

 

[arthur]

This is ridiculous. I haven't watched this much P in years.

I should have plenty of opportunity to feel my urge, and the shame and pain afterwards. But there's nothing. I'm totally numb.

 

[arthur]

Then again, the increase in P watching has its logic. If P is my primary avoidance strategy, and the "stopping P" project forces me to confront my anxiety, then what will I do to cope? Watch P, of course.

Rather strangely, I remain rather optimistic in the face of it.

Also, started reading yet another book (Power over P, by Brian Brandenburg). I got it for free and had an hour to kill on the bus, so I thought why not. Once again I was put off at first, this time because for me as a non-American, the frequent mentions of congregations, church leaders, the Lord, etc. is rather alien (so far though, the religion stuff is unimportant). Also, it's written in the form of a novel, and as a novel, it's really awful.

However. It seems to follow more or less the same principles as the other book on The Subject I'm reading right now (see previous post). And about half way through the book, I came upon something I've never read before. It rang so true with me I giggled a little. It's the idea that the mind's tendency to rebel against rules and restrictions, even (or especially?) self-imposed ones, can play a major role in compulsive P watching. So deciding to STOP P FOR GOOD cannot work. Not only because suppressing the temptation to watch P keeps the idea of P ever-present, but because the mind does not like to be pushed around. The advice is to remember that you always have a choice. You can always watch P if you decide you want to, but you have to learn to make an informed decision, not blindly follow your conditioning.

 

[Lincoln]

Hey Arthur, I too find it difficult to MO without having P follow. It may be the same day or the next day, but it just feels like the urge grows. I don't know what happens when we fall off the wagon so to speak, but I do know it can take sometime/effort/energy to find the will to start again (at least this has been the case for me). Different things have helped me in the past, but none are really consistent either. Usually it is an act of making some kind of commitment through a change of behavior that helps. Like installing a new blocker, (or starting a new journal - like I'm doing now), or something along those lines. I think these things are only temporary but can serve a purpose. Maybe it's like making the choice based on an informed decision, like you mention, and doing it in different areas of life - not just regarding PMO.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

Hey arthur,
Site I was telling you about is:
http://www.ted.com/talks/shawn_achor_the_happy_secret_to_better_work
The last 5 minutes in video the practices are mentioned.
Trying to follow these still.

Interesting that thing you shared about  trying to suppress the temptation to watch P keeps the idea of P ever-present. There is some true in that.
Although I haven't watched P yet and I thought I was cured, urges came back big style yesterday. So if it's a choice, you just have to decide you won't
watch P then. easier to say than done that.
I think that its tougher for you because you started P at a much earlier age than me and you have P access during work hours.
I have P access only at home and at night when everyone sleeping.
Right now, I am aiming to build my self confidence, hoping this will help me reduce my social anxieties and less thoughts of P.
Will build self confidence by more positive self talks and writing about achievements I should be proud of. don't know if that would help. will try it.
A simple suggestion, why don't u try no MO as well ? and MO when P urges really really high as backup like am doing.
I do have more energy than before to fight P urges as when I MOd everyday. And MO somehow tends to bring back P urges afterwards.
vicious circle.

 

[arthur]

Thanks for the link Phoenix, I'll watch it as soon as I can.

No MO is what I'm doing for now. I have finished the "Power Over P" book, and am pretty confident that this is the way to go for me. It recommends no MO, so this is what I'll (not) do.

I have to say, reading this book was kind of an eye-opener. I'm glad I only learned after reading it that the author is a pastor -- I probably wouldn't have bothered with it had I known. Religion plays only a very small role in the book though.

The main focus of the book is on what to do in the instance you're temped to watch P. The book aims to train you to recognize temptations as soon as they arise, and then apply what it calls ACV (one of many acronyms in the book): Acknowledge and Accept the temptation, remind yourself that you always have a Choice, and choose the consequences of your actions: short-term gratification and long-term misery, or following your Vision. The vision is an ideal you aspire to that the book helps you to build. In practice, ACV means that each time you are tempted (i.e. by flashbacks) you say (out loud if possible, in your thoughts otherwise): "I'm tempted to view and do" (the book's code for PMO), "but I can choose freely and I choose to follow my vision of?", and then state your vision. In fact, the instruction is to write this down on a card that you always carry with you and take out and read whenever your tempted.

You're supposed to practice ACV at least twice a day for the rest of your life. If no temptations come up, generate some! This is one of the recommendations that are pretty contrary to everything else I've read. The book teaches you to accept your temptations, and specifically warns of suppressing, avoiding, protecting against (e.g. by using filter software), or substituting them. There are other scheduled practices (daily, weekly, monthly), but they don't take up much time.

Ok, got to finish now, door bell's ringing.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

Hi arthur, That seems like a nice book. The nice part is that it does not encourage to suppress things. I believe that suppressing could make things hide somewhere in your unconscious and make you less aware of yourself or your actions later.
Was thinking of something this morning which wanted to tell you. Each time you relapse, there must be a thought pattern that cropped up. Something that convinced you at that moment that what you are about to do feels right, yea? because its only after you've done it that you don't feel its right. Your mind produces arguments, reasons for you to accept to relapse.
If you are aware of those arguments, reasons, you could prepare counter arguments for when you have them. Just like on the cards you carry with you.
For example, me I tended to think that P helped me because it relaxes me and I need it after lots of stress. Also, I used to believe that MO with P is the only true MO since that is when I get the most satisfaction and best for my body. After reading around and posting on forum, realizing that P is not that beneficial, I can face it better. Each time P thoughts come around, I think of my counter arguments.. and MO as last resort. I fear I am repressing things by doing that though. Things like when I am acting like robocop, today there was that gorgeous gal which I wanted to stare at but I was a robocop.. Ain't I suppressing and missing out somewhere?
Good luck arthur.

 

[arthur]

Back after three weeks. It's not been going well. I've had a lot to avoid, and boy did I avoid it. Fear of not finishing my PhD work for the next deadline, mainly. So I did NO work, while I would have had to work day and night to make it. Haven't spoken to my supervisor who has been waiting for the draft of an article for more than a week. The article does not exist, not a single line.

Instead of working, I looked at P. Every day. For hours. Said I'd be working on my PhD project, went to the home office, and started watching.

I should feel bad, probably. But I don't really. Just resigned, apathetic.

All the great plans I laid out here, all was forgotten within a few hours. Or not quite forgotten: I somehow managed to tell myself I was still in the process of quitting P, all the while fapping along. It's so ridiculous. I even avoided coming here.

I guess it's time I sought professional help, finally. Googled a bit and found a therapist in my town who specializes in "internet addiction", among other things. You know what's scary? That this is the last straw, in a way. If it fails, I'm pretty much out of options. So I hesitate. Wife is not here, will be back on Sunday. I'll finally tell her that my P habit is out of control, and that I need her help. I'll also try to follow the Power over P program again? but to tell the truth, I don't think I'll make it longer than a day or two.

Thank you Phoenix (if you're still here). I've tried the counter-arguments approach for a while (even wrote down conversations with my P sub-personality?) but ultimately, it's not about arguments for me. At some point, I just don't give a fuck. I know full well, even when I'm watching P, that it's a stupid choice, that I will regret it later, that it only worsens the problems I'm running away from. But I don't give a fuck. PMO just feels too good. Facing my problems feels bad. I think, I haven't actually faced any in quite a while.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

yeps still here arthur.
Hope it goes well with the therapist for you. I guess you finding refuge in P because of too much havoc around you. If you found a way to handle the things around, PHd n other stresses, might be easier handle the P then mayb.
Funny though, I know exactly what u mean, my life was like that once, I had to P to escape from all the problems, run away from them. N I wanted to thank you for ur support arthur, I don't think would have made it so many days without ur help n few others here.
Have patience n belief in urself. Its a fight between you n you. not mike tyson ! so u are bound to win.
Good luck arthur.

 

[PhoenixRevival]

Knock knock. Not seeing u here. Hope u doing OK. Best of luck man. Thx 4 ur support. Cia