Porn addiction vs sex addiction

nannitac

Member
hi, i am 34yo guy. i started to be addicted to PMO from 20yo, up to 24 yo i escalated as many of you to porn festish. Then i was curious to try similar experiences with prostitutes and shemales. From 24 yo I could say that same period i was more addicted to PMO and sometimes more to sex. Before to decide to start reboot process i was actually more addicted to sex even if sometimes (not everiday) i was PMOing.
I believe that the vast majority of concepts of PMO can easily considered valid for my sex addiction...in particular rush in dopamine and how addiction affects your brain and in general life. i often experience cravings, related to sex i had in the past, urges to go to visit prostitutes and check escort profiles.
Any of you have similar experience of combined sex/PMO addiction?
 
W

William

Guest
Hi.  This is an important question.  Part of the Rubik's cube of understanding porn induced dopamine addiction is to first understand and embrace some key concepts, that can be very confusing.  Porn induced dopamine addiction is confusing because, especially for the guy who has just recognized the problem, and is trying to fix it, it looks like a sexual issue.  One of the difficult, initial, concepts, and yet one of the most obvious, is:  Porn is not sex, porn abuse is not the same as abusing sex for a dopamine hit; sex addiction is not porn addiction.  It is true they both involve abusing the brain's dopamine reward center.  But porn, unlike sex, even sex with a stranger, requires almost no effort.  Close the door where your computer is, and, wallah, it is there. Sex addiction, at least acting on it, actually requires some effort.  A sex addict gets off by searching for a partner, like a porn addict gets off for searching for the never before seen image.  But, a porn addict can be successful in that search, every day, 100% of the time.  I suppose a sex addict, who is willing to pay for it, could achieve the same result, but, again, the difference is ease of access.  Though some porn addicts do pay for porn (I never did, because it is so easy to access), most porn addicts do not.  In fact, if I had to guess, most sex addicts don't pay for sex, either, because a lot of that searching is about winning the prize, as opposed to paying for it.  Winning it is part of the thrill. 

To answer your question, I was probably a sex addict, at least a little, before I was a porn induced dopamine addict.  Those two behaviors, for me at least, never overlapped.  When I got hooked on porn I quit looking for sex, because the reason I looked for sex, though I did not know it at the time, was the dopamine high it gave me.  When I could get that for 5% the effort, and free, any time, any place, actual sex became much less interesting to me.  For the record, I never had a problem finding sex.  The neurological term would be that I became "desensitized to actual sex."  That, in turn, leads to sexual dysfunction, such as PIED or anorgasmia, or the inability to reach O unless with P. 

I feel sorry for you if you have both problems, because I think that while they look similar, they are actually two, different, addictions, and are probably, to some extent, reinforcing. 

My advice:  Get the reboot in, get back to balanced, get back to normal.  Then, clean, figure out who you really are, without porn being an example of who you want to be sexually.  By the time most of us get hooked on porn, the porn we have to watch to get off is nothing like what we really see ourselves enjoying or engaging in. 

 

nannitac

Member
i am actually rebooting following concepts of reboot from PMO. I experienced severe withdrawal effects like huge cravings to visit escort profiles or sex cams. I believe i am more sex addicted since my cravings are direct more to visit prostitutes.
I believe that main difference is that
- PMO addiction is more related to dopamine rush addiction
- sex addiction envolves also dopamine rush but i believe is also an emotional escape  from committed relationship, in particular when you feel rejected.
i can tell you that i visited very often prostitutes in particular after i broke with my previous GF, it was a way to empty my frustration
 
W

William

Guest
Yes.  Withdrawals totally suck.  But, they are inevitable, and, for many, a good sign.  If you are suffering terrible withdrawals, it is a sign you are doing what you are supposed to be doing during the reboot:  denying yourself a gratuitous dopamine hit.  Remember, especially during the reboot, porn is not porn, porn is a chameleon, it changes.  It is whatever you can see or experience to get a dopamine hit, and when you turn off your commonly used buttons, it offers new, different, buttons.  Sex cams and escort profiles are just porn in another form.  If you would like to understand my method, Get Educated, Get Tools, and Learn to Love Withdrawals, hit the link in my signature box.

Peace. 
 

pfree1805

Active Member
The recent Cambridge study found sex addicts experience more reward centre activity wen viewing porn. Therefore sex addicts are addicted to any sexual stimuli, virtual or real.

This may help you:

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-11-online-porn-sex-addicts-desire.html

Also, Sex Addicts Anonymous covers both porn and sex addiction so you might want to try that.
 

Gary Wilson

Active Member
pfree1805 said:
The recent Cambridge study found sex addicts experience more reward centre activity wen viewing porn. Therefore sex addicts are addicted to any sexual stimuli, virtual or real.

This may help you:

http://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-11-online-porn-sex-addicts-desire.html

Also, Sex Addicts Anonymous covers both porn and sex addiction so you might want to try that.
The press release said "sex addicts", but all the subjects were actually "porn addicts". Since there's no accepted term denoting porn addict, different studies will use different terms. This study, and the 2 preceding by the same group, use "individuals with compulsive sexual behaviors". The full study - http://www.journalofpsychiatricresearch.com/article/S0022-3956%2815%2900313-1/fulltext#sec2.1
 

nannitac

Member
Dear Gary about sex addiction i would ask you in particular your opininion since i read you bbok and found very inspiring.
Some years ago i started dating prostitutes and shemales, looking in the streets fro SW girls to feel the same dopamine rush in reality. I was convinced that was better then fapping in front of my pc since i was doing sex, but i was dramatically wrong! i end up alternating sex and porn addiction in last 8 years of my life. i wasted several GF for my addiction and inability to get in intimacy and connection with them, i defenetely understood there was a problem in my sexuality.
Now i give up both activities applying same concepts of porn addiction to sex addiction....it seems working as well. My sex addiction started from porn addiction so i believe is possible cure it in the same way...after all it is always a dopamine induced addiction.
When i was looking in the street for sw prostitutes i felt exactly the same arousal and craving for sex, i feel also same sense of novelty since there are lots of girls stanting on the same street. People like me hooked up to SW girls go around the streets looking for the most exciting girls, while looking to several of them the arousal grow up exactly how when you PMO with different porn scenes. After 2/3 hrs looking for girls i  choosed the most exciting and had sex with her...i was getting aroused by coolidge effect induced not anymore by porn but by SW girls.
 

Gary Wilson

Active Member
Whether it's searching for porn or for prostitutes the same brain mechanisms are at work. The cravings and seeking arise from sensitized pathways.

Back in the early 80's when "sex addiction" started to be recognized, the model put forth by Carnes claimed that nearly all individuals with sex addiction had some sort of childhood trauma, and most had co-morbidities (other addictions, bipolar disorder, anxiety disorders). Now that young people are growing up on tube sites, I believe that model no longer universally applies. That said, if you think your sex addiction is related to other issues, or that you cannot break free, a qualified therapist may be in order.
 

nannitac

Member
thank you Gary, that confirms my idea, my complulsive search for sex with SW prostistutes is driven by dopamine rush, a per coolidge effect i experience the arousal to choose between several available possible partners. At the moment i am trying to apply comcepts of rewiring from PMO addiction and actually seems working. I see also a therapist and i spoke also with him about my approach.
He said that have clear what is happening in my brain is helping me a lot to solve the addiction
 

User74

New Member
Hi all, I am dude currently in my third week of my reboot. The last three weeks have been very painful. I have one question, does someone experience headaches and body weakness during a reboot?
 

Gary Wilson

Active Member
pfree1805 said:
Thanks for the correction Gary, interesting how the study got misreported.
It's not misreported. The term "sex addiction" was the term used by Valerie Voon in her press release. It just shows how far we have to go.

1) We need studies need to delineate porn addiction from sex addiction.

2) Researchers need to create valid assessment questionnaires for porn addiction. Many of the studies on porn addicts have used "hypersexuality questionnaires". This is a very important point as most young porn addicts would score very low on hypersexuality assessments. This results in some studies having a very diverse group of subjects, where severe porn addicts are placed in the control group, and guys who act out with prostitutes,, but aren't addicted to porn are in the "hypersexual group".
 
W

William

Guest
Again, a very interesting and important topic, and one that is vital for a porn addict to understand.  When Gary Wilson uses the word "hypersexual" me means literally, people who have a lot of sex. One of the main distinctions between porn addiction and sex addiction is that porn addicts often have little sex at all, no sex, or are actually virgins.  Also, some porn addicts cannot have sex due to PIED.  These two addictions look a little alike, in the way porn and sex look a little a like, but, one is real, one is artificial sexual stimulation.  Both involve dopamine rushes, but one requires interaction with reality, whereas the other can be done with pure fantasy. 
 

Gary Wilson

Active Member
William said:
Again, a very interesting and important topic, and one that is vital for a porn addict to understand.  When Gary Wilson uses the word "hypersexual" me means literally, people who have a lot of sex. One of the main distinctions between porn addiction and sex addiction is that porn addicts often have little sex at all, no sex, or are actually virgins.  Also, some porn addicts cannot have sex due to PIED.  These two addictions look a little alike, in the way porn and sex look a little a like, but, one is real, one is artificial sexual stimulation.  Both involve dopamine rushes, but one requires interaction with reality, whereas the other can be done with pure fantasy.
The problem......
Most brain studies to date on porn users are measuring brain activation in response to cues. Greater activation is a sign of addiction. For example, a study on crack addicts, cue-reactivity would be photo of a crack pipe. Most of the studies on porn users have used photos, though Voon used videos. The photos are pretty tame: some may only be nudes, other photos are plain heterosexual sex.

The problem is that viewing a sexual photo is NOT technically a cue for a porn addict. Instead, it's the addictive behavior: Viewing porn. That's why a few studies have reported LESS brain activation in porn addicts (compared to controls) when viewing photos. Why? Porn addicts need more stimulation because they are desensitized, or have habituated to vanilla porn. 

On the other hand, a photo of a naked women could be a powerful cue or trigger for a "hypersexual" who's addiction is seeking out prostitutes. The nude photo would likely activate the reward center, and initiate cravings to seek out a prostitute. In this case a vanilla photo would foster a much greater brain activation than a non-addict.

What we have is two opposing results because the subjects were not properly categorized as either a porn addict or a sex addict. Making it even more complicated is that 1) the "healthy controls" in these studies are also watching porn, and 2) the brains of all heterosexual men light up when we see naked women. 

Take away: For all studies we have the results..... and we have the interpretation of the results.
 
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