Caught- again.

[unlovedwife]

Hi all, I'm looking for some support and coping strategies. I felt like raping my husband today.

Some background. Married three years, no children and it feels like we are just friends/flatmates. I discovered his porn collection (hard copy) shortly after we moved in together. He threw it out, saying 'I have you, I don't need it anymore'. The sheer volume of magazines and dvds was daunting, but I took him at his word. About six months and numerous computer viruses into the marriage, I cleaned his computer. No records of anything on the internet other than P, and P featuring women almost the opposite of me physically. After being confronted, he announced he was leaving and stormed off. That is when I first found ybop. At one stage I would catch my husband masturbating to porn every time I came home. He was embarrassed, refused to talk about it and stormed off every time. If he did talk, it was the addict speaking, all talk, no action.
This pattern has continued, I have told him that I will support him, that I feel threatened in my role because of his use of P, and finally that just because his libido is focused purely on pixels it doesn't mean mine does. I am a married woman in my twenties and I haven't had sex in nearly two years. He has made excuses for six months to avoid seeing a specialist in sexual addiction therapy that I have found for him, has hidden porn stashes around the house, has lied to me countless times all the while being the sweetest friend that anyone ever had. I really care for him, but this is doing my head in.

Today after about a week of no(t being caught with) porn, I discovered that he has found a way around the internet filter on the pc and has been browsing pornography, to the point of taking a day off of work yesterday with fourteen hours of internet porn. This morning, I lost it and confronted him physically and verbally. As per usual he stormed off. I am worried about the effect that this is having on me. My therapist is not really helping and I'm beginning to think that it might be easier to leave before I become aggressive to the point of physically hurting him. I don't want to be that angry nagging wife, but his addiction is hurting me so badly that I often think of leaving.

How can I approach this more constructively? His continued behaviour doesn't gel with the repeated "I'll stop" and "I love you" that I hear from the wonderful man that I married. Is there a way for me to stop being hurt and reactionary? What advice do the men on here have? I really feel like I am losing the plot.

 

[Serendipity77]

I feel for you, I really do. I'm in a very similar situation. My husband won't accept he has an addiction. You simply cannot make them do something, they need to do it themselves.

I was given some good advice yesterday. To focus on me. It's easy to lose who you are when you constantly fret about your husband & his addiction.

I hope other people will post some advice. I just wanted to let you know you're not alone.

Good luck

 

[Maxime]

I'm pretty sure you can't force someone into solutions- as crazy as it may sound. Like you said: the addiction is speaking.
Clearly, though, you're not approaching the situation correctly.
I think that the worst way to have someone understand your point is with confrontational speeches and actions.
That being said, you do have to respect yourself.
Did you show him articles or videos on this? I found Gabe's videos to be easily watchable and inspiring.
Show him how a life without porn will be better for him and you.
Doing the opposite, i.e let him know how porn is bad for your couple, might not help that much.
That's what I think. For me, I realized it when I already had PIED, which is also an effective eye-opener. Just, not ideal, of course!

 

[Jimmy James]

I am so sorry for what you are going through.  I can't begin to understand what it feels like to you.

I consider myself fortunate that I decided I had hit rock bottom on my own without my wife discovering or confronting me about my porn use.  I believe that no one will make major changes in their life unless they really want to deep down inside. Usually this means hitting rock bottom or some type of life changing event.  Unfortunately I don't think your husband has hit rock bottom. Even if he thinks he needs to stop using porn, realize it is not easy to do because of all the brain chemistry stuff you have read about on YBOP.  I knew for a long time that I had a problem and tried to stop using, but it took a while before I hit my rock bottom and actually was finally able to stop.

I think step one is for him to acknowledge that he has a problem.  An addict can feel helpless to stop their behavior.  With porn addiction, education is very helpful as it helps you understand why you have been unable to stop in the past.  I suggest having him read everything here and on YBOP, but it will still be up to him to use that info to make the necessary changes.

 

[Chaos Mind]

Hi there unlovedwife,

this call for help really touches me - and makes me kind of sad. I sense tremendous frustration in your post (and in your screen name), so first of all I wish you the best of support in this forum! Having others to share your story with will take away some of the weight that you are carrying at the moment.

There are some thoughts wandering around my brain, some impressions I have about what you told us.

(1) I find it strange that you catch your husband so often! I have been using porn for many years and neither my ex, nor my current gf have ever had an idea. Sexual material stored on HD I protected by password, my browser history and cookies I deleted everytime I've been to XXX-sites. I have been cautious that I always had enough time to be back in my pants when she's come home earlier than expected. Or in short: I was trying really hard not to be caught. Why? Because I've always been ashamed for what I did. I told myself she'd not understand, but in fact I was simply embarrassed. The fact your husband leaves so many traces for you either means he doesn't give a shit if you know or not (that would be a bad scenario), or it's one way of seeking help. As if he couldn't tell, but wanted you to know.

(2) He is bypassing filters. That means he has not accepted his problem. I personally dislike any method that aims at "avoiding". As you can see: if you want to browse for porn, there is always a way to do it. And if you have a strong urge, no resistance will be tough enough to make you stop. Filters and similar techniques are only suitable for those who want to quit from the bottom of their heart, but know they are too easily tempted. But bypassing the filters is a conscious act - it's something you do on purpose and it shows that he is not willing to give up his addiction.

(3) Your marriage is based on mutual distrust. You catch him, he tells you he will stop. You control his progress, realize he hadn't kept his words. You confront him, demand improvement. He promises again, finds more clever ways to cheat. You control again - closer this time. And so on and so on. This appears to me like a competition, only this isn't a game. It's life, it's love, it's marriage. If it continues this way, one of you will finally go crazy. Can you imagine a life where you trust his words without controlling if he is honest with you? Maybe that's one way to break the cycle. When he realizes you gave up controlling, he might feel compelled to return a portion of trust. Just one suggestion.

(4) The fact that you haven't had sex in two years is what troubles me most. Is it because he can't or is it because he doesn't want to? Does he know that he risks his marriage and is unable to change, or does he take you for granted?

One of the most difficult things for partners of addicts is how to make clear to their husbands that they have to change or the relationship will be over - without making it sound like an emotional blackmail. How can you make him accept help without pushing him? These are difficult questions to ask. But one thing is for sure: he needs to change.

The other difficult thing for you is to understand your role in all that situation. It's never right to say "I am not beautiful enough - that's why he uses porn". But it's also wrong to say "this is HIS fault alone. I am the angel and he's the devil". No relationship works in black and white. One thing leads to another and the two of you might want to sort things out. In the end it's chemical, yes. But what does he express with his addiction? What's his main driver?

Best of luck!

 

[sodonewithit]

I pulled all that shit on my wife but I never had stashes or filters.  As the above poster said there are other issues on top of tbe porn but imo if he stops the rest will/might get delt with.  Sorry lady, this porn stuff is so shitty I can't believe what negative impact it has.  Till he stops he's going to stay being the same spineless guy, again sorry.  I can't believe my wife stuck with me till I stumbled onto this site but it does work if he finds us.

There isn't any advice as a guy that I can give you other than I hope you stay strong and you have to look out for number one.

 

[unlovedwife]

Thankyou everyone for responding, this isn't something I can discuss comfortably with anyone so I really appreciate the support and opinions from others.

My husband is not remotely computer savvy and my job means irregular working hours dependant upon how busy the shift is. I was catching him regularly in the lounge, where I moved his computer.

Until I confronted him he had no idea that browser history existed. Thinking on it, he has never verbalised that he has an addiction. I don't think he has admitted it to himself, which could be why he is making half-hearted efforts to stop. He has said 'you don't like it, so I will stop'. Maybe he thinks it is me overreacting, from what others have said on here it seems common. He also has depression symptoms, something I believe to be linked with PMO. The shame/guilt complex he has built up around PIED and PMO is huge.

I know I cannot trust him. I have told him so. This last attempt at me leaving him to do his own thing without accountability was three weeks where I didn't check on his online activities. I ignored the feeling of hurt every night when I tried to initiate sex and he wasn't in the mood. I have communicated with him that I cannot sleep and that my brain is not working properly because of the mess that our marriage is. He has walked off every time and now sleeps in the spare room. I've been mentally absent at work lately and my staff have noticed to the point of trying to slip things past me. He doesn't like me checking on him, but he needs some form of accountability, yet will not speak of his problem with anyone.

The PMO has caused him to lose interest in real women. He will ogle unknown women in public, yet goes out of his way not to look at me naked, or at my body at any time. He never initiates anything remotely sexual and makes excuses when I try to initiate something. It honestly feels like he is being selfish, in not giving me any pleasure while masturbating multiple times a day. I continually reassure him that he is attractive, I try to be supportive and caring, but if things don't change I have the options of divorce or adultery.

I have tried to give him the resources to get help. I have bookmarked this site and ybop. We watched the first ybop video together, he said he wasn't comfortable, so I asked him to watch the others and explore the site when he felt comfortable. (I bookmarked both sites on his browser) His browser history since then shows that he has looked at ybop once in the past year, while having multiple tabs of porn open. (discovered an add on for chrome that locks browser history).

After receiving a phone bill of several thousand dollars of data three months after the wedding, he now has a prepaid phone. To make me feel better he accepted an old style 'brick phone' with no internet connectivity, yet made up excuse after excuse to get his smartphone back. I installed the k9 brower on his smartphone and returned it. To the best of my knowledge, he is not spending excessively on phone credit, so I hope that this avenue is no longer a threat.

Your opinions have helped me realise that I am doing this, he probably is humouring me when he lies and says that he will stop. I don't want to ignore the problem, I want him to get help. How did you guys 'hit rock bottom' and realise that you needed to do something about it?

 

[chickaboomski]

The unlovedwife... You are not alone. I resonate with all the negative emotions you have. And I too felt it impossible to deal with without unleashing the fury and hurt that I was suffering back on my man. However, finding this forum before taking any action was probably the best thing. I had no idea how to express how I felt, and make him realise it was his actions and behavior causing them Without letting the agressivness out. But as I read and communicated with other women who had been on the journey much longer than I, I finally realised that it can be done with love. Let's face it, if you didn't love him, you would have left. All the emotions and torture you feel is normal. I understand how you caught him so often as I did too. My man didn't realise I suspected anything, had no idea why I was distant, hurting and anxious had any idea it came from porn. He had no idea I was even checking his history. If there is any advice I can pass on that I received from here, is to come at it from the angle of being a couple, being together and  that th'reeffecting your togetherness, that it is eroding the basis of what it means to be a couple. The more you both are on the attack, it will mean the point is lost in the ambush and it becomes a tit for tat situation. My Journey has not reached the point where he has admitted his addiction. But he has admitted the damage he has unknowingly done to our relationship, and has acknowledged that it is damaging for couples. As another hurt partner said to me the other day... It is all baby steps. There are no leaps and bounds in progress that is sustainable. Be sure to look after yourself. And nurture your own mind and self esteem. Because his addiction means he won't until he admits the damage that's done. Stay strong, and keep sane here. Much love Xx

 

[unlovedwife]

Thankyou chickaboomski. I appreciate your support. I read the posts of other partners and feel sad that this is happening to all of us, yet hopeful because of the success stories. I know I should try to concentrate on myself more, but it is so difficult when it feels like I am half a person, and a failing half to boot.

 

[klarson27]

I'm so sorry for the pain you're experiencing.. I did that to my wife for 12 years as well..

I'm finally free from porn but... I'm not free from the guilt of the pain I caused my wife.

The fact that he's replaced you with porn gives you every right to demand that he stop. Also, I should note that if a married man truly stops porn (and masturbating) he will most certainly begin to show interest in his wife sexually so that could be an indicator to you whether or not he's using. You're lucky that he's not truly computer savvy in that you may be able to view his history and see what kind of P he's using.

 

[Hopeful Holly]

Wow.  You just told my story almost exactly except my husband is incredibly computer savvy so it was difficult to tell if he was using or not.  I have known of his addiction for 4 years now and each year has gotten more and more toxic and distant between us.  I tried turning a blind eye after I realized he wasn't ready for recovery.  it worked for a year.  I just did a lot of Hot Yoga and acted as if.  We had sex twice last year, the second was only after we saw a marriage therapist who gave us some exercises to be intimate again, and I got pregnant.  After finding out I was pregnant I couldn't pretend their wasn't a problem anymore.  Being pregnant was an eye opener?.I really can't bring a child into this toxic situation, so I gave him an ultimatum at that point.  Either get help or I'm out?after some days to think he finally agreed to get help.  He got a sponsor in Sex Addicts Anonymous, started working the steps and saw a sex therapist once a month, which we saw together one session.  I had hope?now 8 months pregnant he is showing all the signs of using again.  Distant, irritable, can't look at me in the eye, no sex (which is kind of weird cause I'm so pregnant), very quiet, and told me last night he's not sure if he can do this thing with me, that he is not attracted to me in many ways including physically. Which I have come to understand is his way of letting me know he isn't ready, but puts the blame on the fact he isn't attracted to me anymore?.I feel your pain.  My pain comes from the same place.  I would convey more of my story but unfortunately I am on very little sleep and must rest.  Sending prayers and love your way...

 

[Chaos Mind]

@chickaboomski: wow, that's an impressive post! It looks like you have been through lots of trouble and reflected the situation very well...you don't make your husband sound like he was a monster, yet you legitimately blame him for the damage he has done. Important thing you pointed out: when porn takes up too much (sexual & temporal) space in his life, the daily basis for you as a couple erodes. That is so true!

@unlovedwife: with the second post you emphasized what I had stated before...your marriage is a constant battle. You challange him. The better your ideas to make him stop, the more creative he will become. That is the most typical sign for addiction in my opinion. I'd like to repeat what chickaboomski has said: the first step would have to be him acknowledging the damage he had done. At the moment he lives a life of lies. He lies to you and betrays you, but (even worse) he lies to himself. Somewhere deep down your husband knows that he is doing harm. But he wipes that feeling away. And the longer he ignores it, the more it hurts to finally bring everything to the surface. It will finally make him go crazy for sure. And when the barrel blows up make sure to be there for him and give him the support he needs. Just like runaway dogs should not be punished when coming back

Good luck!

 

[Silver]

As far as my relationship understanding go, there are a few things I know. Ultimatums are bad. One can't just say, do this, or this will happen. This creates a discontinuity on the personality and it becomes really hard to stick to a choice. The other thing that I know, is that you can't force someone's behavior to change. If someone doesn't want to change, he won't change. You can accept it, or you can't. Now, about relationship, there's also that wonderful thing that I would call, creativity. There's seldom just one solution to a problem. You can be creative about it, and find fun ways to deal with an issue. That's what I'm trying to do right now with my reboot, I want it to be fun, instead of that mean, hard and tough and scary way that everyone talks about. So I'm designing ways to try to solve my ED that is also fun and won't feel like a self prison.

I don't have much to suggest, you know him better than I do. But if you put all on his shoulders, things will explode. This is not something one can solve alone in a relationship. He can either solve it by himself, as a celibate, or with you, as a couple. That doesn't mean turning a blind eye. It means, complicity through a solution. But... honestly, 2 years without sex XD I wouldn't be able to stand it maybe there are other things. Have you ever considered taking a break from him? Creating some distance? Maybe he'll miss you. Maybe he won't too (in which case it says a lot).

 

[Gracie]

I would like to disagree with giving ultimatum.  It depends on how your phrase it.  I told my husband that if our relationship was to continue I needed him to do certain things.  If he could not do them, then our marriage would probably end.  Then we both knew we had to work together.  When trust is gone, the marriage is in the worst jeopardy imaginable.  Without trust, there can be no relationship.  We wives have to be able to define the relationship.  The addict has defined it for far too long.  We cannot be in that toxic place any longer. 

What's more is the addict has defined the relationship in secret.  He has decided about contact with us.  Sex with us.  His relationship to the world has been redefined.  He has completely changed the marriage without so much as a word to us.  If we do not express our feelings and fears and hopes and dreams for our marriage and relationship.  We are a part of the solution.

 

[Hopeful Holly]

Well put Gracie, my thoughts and words exactly.  If fact it wasn't until I gave him the ultimatum that he made the efforts to change.  It was after 4 years of me trying to be understanding, loving, and giving him his space to come into recovery on his own when I finally stood up and said NO MORE.  He knew then I was serious, that I wasn't going to enable the situation any longer and that I was ready to start rebuilding our foundation, was he? If not I'm out.  I didn't give it a time line, I am aware that a relapse or two or three may be in the future but what will he do after?  As long as he is trying and admitting his addiction and is being honest and we learn how to talk about it and get help, on our own and couples therapy, I have no doubt we will overcome this thing.

 

[unlovedwife]

I know there are partners out there who have tolerated the addiction and it's relationship side effects for many years, and maybe that is right for those relationships. I just know that the negative side effects of my husband's addiction are starting to do me serious damage mentally.
I love him, but I will have to leave him before it destroys my life as well. My ability to work has been compromised, my functions as a wife are becoming difficult (depressed and teary= no housework/finances are getting done) and my family want to know why I am becoming reclusive (there's no way I could admit that I hate myself for not being good enough for my husband). An ultimatum isn't a good thing, but this is our last chance. I don't want to lose my husband, but I cannot continue like this for my own wellbeing. I am thankful that we do not have children.

 

[sodonewithit]

"not being good enough" isn't a line which want you to say.  At best he's a addict at worse a moron but you not being good enough isn't the truth.  That's saying the blame is with you and just giving a excuse to him.  You clearly said you want to shag so it's not a story of you saying no. 

The porn crushes us guys in ways we just don't understand but that's not a viable answer anyways.  I can sadly recall my wife naked in bed, myself wanting to be with her but when push came to shove I wasn't there physically or mentally.  It wasn't fair to her and she/you wasn't to blame but was truly the victim.  I'll never look at porn again, will never masturbate and am no longer mentally cheating(only in hindsight am I calling it this).  IMO every woman should get the same respect. 

I hope to one day regain her full trust but we shall see.  I hope that you find the same.

 

[Steam rolled]

sodnewithit  Is absolutely correct its not about us not being good enough!
Its VERY VERY hard to believe and understand i know but when the spinning mind slowed down more and more threw the past 9+ months it really isn't our fault or about us.
Yes at times i still blame myself.
And don't understand why - its hard to explain that in knowing it wasn't about me/us but yet cant fully let it go of that horrible feeling.
It sucks!


But only until my PA SO got knowledge that YES this is truly a addition that took over him did he become confused,ashamed and openly very sorry for what he was doing and he swore he don't want to live that way anymore.
What immediately worked for him was sitting with head phones on and listening to Gabe's videos!!
He is not a forum type of guy,in fact not a computer guy at all he only knows how to get to " Those " sites, so he asked to have data blocked also at his request.
But not until he put the pieces together through Gabe's videos - HE WAS TRAPPED!

So then and I will not call it a ultimatum but a  mutual agreement that we agreed that  our lives together CAN and WILL continue but ONLY continue without Porn addiction!

And the healing began!

Best of luck and be strong!

 

[Chaos Mind]

I agree with the two posts obove this one.

If my gf was to find out about my former addiction and me virtually cheating on her basically every day of the first 3 years of our relationship, she'd definitifely take it personal. How could she not? How could I ever ask her to understand this isn't about HER. She could have been anyone and I'd still have developed the same problem.

That makes it twice as complicated for the involved female part of the suffering relationship: first there's the sadness about the fact her bf/husband has been using porn all the time during the past X years. Secondly they feel like helplessly uninvolved participants of their personal horror show. If things were that simple (she's too ugly -> man seeks porn) then everything was clear. But truth is: there IS no easy explanation. You can't argue about the problem on a rational basis. Yet men cannot just plead hormons as a master excuse for all and everything.

Let's put it in simple words which are valid for me and supposingly for many other men:
- I love my girlfriend. Always have. No compromise there
- I played down the role of porn. It's like you don't actually kill people on video games. It's just pixels, right?
- I rationalized: "everybody watches porn. Why shouldn't I?". Also: I am just a man. And I do what men do - so what?
- I continously looked for greener grass. Not only at my neighbor's lawn, but in front yards of the whole world. The kick needs to be better and better. Women are getting ridiculously beautiful and sexy. I finally reach spheres were I just can't compare real life women to those I admire on a screen. The two world have become perfectly separated. Ladies, ask yourself: is your husband as handsome as George Clooney? There is no answer. You can't compare! So is your husband cheating you with a woman that he finds more attractive than you? There is no answer to the question. You can't compare. It's not about you. It's about the other world.

But I understand that this is very very very hard to understand, since porn abuse also affects your sex life and thus steals your husband's ultimate way to show his attraction. Step by step the daily basis for a loving partnership erodes. Because a different world takes over, covering the little and big aspects of your life. And you are not part of the game. Well, sometimes there is a connection between wife and porn abuse, but it's subtle and on a completely different level than most women would expect the problem to be based on.