.

[BigMog]

Hi Discobolus,

I agree with Pcpowder about posting often. My slips tend to coincide with when I?ve not been reading on this site or others for a few days and more recently when I didn?t make the time to post here.

Looks to me you?re heading in the right direction-keep at it!

 

[workinprogressUK]

Since I?ve started slipping up there has been more negative thinking on my part.

Or do you think it could have been the other way around? Chicken and egg? I can't think of ever having slipped-up when I was "positively thinking". Actively keeping my brain in a positive, healthy, place keeps me away from relapse. The challenge for me is stopping a bunch of long-term, underlying issues from hijacking that positive, proactive, mind management and sending me back into dark places. But it's almost always the negativity that happens before the slip-up for me.... and of course I dump a whole heap of negativity on myself after a slip-up... and you get into that old Buddhist "second arrow" syndrome of punishing yourself hard after a minor fail. Discobulus... you clicked on a couple of images you know you shouldn't have, but your trend is positive, right? Don't let your inner chimp convince you that a couple of little slips means you should throw all the progress away. Stay strong! You're doing well!

 

[workinprogressUK]

You're not and you've never been any sort of a piece of shit. You deserve love, respect and compassion just as much as the next person. I don't know you, but I'll bet there's a load of things that make you a valuable human being. Doesn't sound like a particularly empathetic thing for your wife to say, but maybe she has a different persona within that friend relationship than she does with you and the family. Up to you whether you want to pick it up with her. Certainly looks from the outside like the relationship is a big source of tension for you.

 

[Pcpowder]

Hi Discolbolus,

What do you think was the strongest trigger for the PMO session?  Was it because your wife was out and you where home alone? Kids asleep?  When she goes out with her friends can you get a sitter and go out with your friends?  What about more prep ahead of time of things to stay busy when you know your re going to be home alone?  What can you do to better prepare when you go out of town and alone in a hotel?

I am sure my wife has discussed my Ed problems with her friends and i cringe at the thought and who she has told.  While i guess its fair that she does as they need to share and have support, but god the thought of her telling her friends is crushing.  However, at the end of the day i know my wife loves me and I don?t see her leaving me over ED issues. Especially for all she knows they are not that frequent because i always stay loaded up on ED meds. 

Given what you have said about your wife and how you have descibed her in your journal, i don?t think you have much to worry about.  Here at day 24 with no MO or PMO i am noticing some very positive things.  Get back on the horse, find motivation in whatever way can and the next time you type in a tube site address just delete it and type in rebootnation.org and come here. 

 

[workinprogressUK]

Maybe I just need to change my expectations.

I reckon 

 

[workinprogressUK]

Wouldn't be a surprise if you had some sort of attachment-association in your addiction. There's a really close link between displacement during childhood and addiction, isn't there? I'm sure you've read similar books to me and it seems to be a common factor. If you've not read "Understanding and Treating Sex Addiction" by Paula Hall, you might find it interesting.

 

[Pcpowder]

Ok man, our lives are to Similiar.  My wife told me this morning she thinks she?s about to get her period. 

Great job in handling your wifes emotional ups and downs.  I am going to learn from you and try and just move on and be happy when my wife tries to pick a fight like it sounds like yours did. 

Just curious if you are still using ED meds? Or have you been going it alone. I?ve had a couple of possitive experiences lately without meds, or i should say i took a 1/3 dose right before my wife and i went at it and she got me hard within 5 minutes of taking the V. So i am pretty sure the V had nothing to do with getting me up since it doesn?t act that fast. 

Have you purchased your Star Treck outfit yet? J/K.  Have you thought anymore about hobbies you want to take up that you mentioned the other day?  Have you reached out to your parents and siblings more? I think your plan and thoughts on that are good ones and just want to urge you to follow through. 

 

[workinprogressUK]

Hey Discobolus.
Sorry to read that things are rough for you. Can't say that I can see any benefit in the wife of a guy who's trying to fix his ED suggesting separation after husband has an ED incident, but she has her own shit to deal with and clearly has her own issues too. To use my own preferred language, she has her own "chimp" and as far as i read it, the chimp in females often tends to get most freaked-out when it feels insecure/unsafe around its partner, and sex can sometimes be "weaponised" to build security. I'm not stating facts, because I know nothing beyond reading your stuff. I'm not judging either of you.... just saying that she clearly has unresolved issues. You clearly have unresolved issues. And your marriage clearly has unresolved issues. Until you resolve them, your mental health's going to continue to be at risk and you're going to be prone to relapses in relation to P, M and over-eating. she's going to continue to be prone to neurotic outbursts and your relationship will either stay difficult, or blow up. Nothing's going to heal until you resolve the deeper issues. The challenge i personally find, as a guy who was multiply fucked-up and self-destructive before I met my wife, is preserving the bandwidth to fix my own shit without neglecting my wife's needs and... eventually, the stuff we need to fix in our marriage. I have a mental health issue, which resulted in P & S addiction, which spun my life out of control, resulting in issues in my marriage. With you, it almost reads like you have a marriage issue, which is causing you anxiety, resulting in porn use, which caused your ED. I don't know.... could be spouting complete bullshit... like our friend from Rajhastan. But to this outside observer, P doesn't look like the biggest issue for you right now. Wish I could help. Hope my words don't make you feel worse. Feeling for you.

 

[workinprogressUK]

Maybe worth saying.... my kids are 11 and 13 now. Walk in the park. Yours are 5 and 2, right? Maybe something in that. I just recall the first two years after my second kids was born, while the first was still a toddler, being the most traumatic and stressful of my life. You're reaching the end of the toughest two years, I reckon. Kid#2 will start becoming more of a source of fun and less of a burden, kid#1's less dependent. your wife might start to de-stress a little and get more sleep, and you'll have more bandwidth to connect together again. Light at the end of the parental tunnel!!

 

[dlansky]

Yours are 5 and 2, right? Maybe something in that. I just recall the first two years after my second kids was born, while the first was still a toddler, being the most traumatic and stressful of my life.

Oh, yeah. I have four kids, and I remember how my stress levels would shoot from 0 to 100 in seconds sometimes. Being a parent requires incredible patience and love. Porn was a way I tried to escape the stress, but not a healthy one; it only made me less patient and less loving in the long run.

 

[workinprogressUK]

I think I need to get into counseling. I?ve got real underlying issues of fear of abandonment and inadequacy.

Hey Discobolus. You've been doing some serious soul searching! Looks like you've sorted a lot of things out in your own head, but maybe you're right about counselling? It really helped me get past my feelings of dependency and guilt about P and address the deeper, underlying issues about attachment, self-esteem and the stuff that was really causing me to stress-out and screw-up. I remember when i had a really good, three-year, streak or P abstinence, that i found new and creative ways to self-destruct without the P  :-\. Counselling might help you get a little deeper and help you start to love yourself a little more. You seem like a pretty cool guy, but you're being ever so hard on yourself. Cut yourself a bit of slack, my friend. You're working hard to be the best person you can be. Wishing you every success.

 

[dlansky]

Congrats on 11 days, and kudos on the counseling.

I am staunchly pro-life as well, but I have think I have been pretty compassionate when speaking with women who have told me they have had abortions. What has always struck me is that, despite the wide use of the phrase "pro-choice," these women have pretty much always expressed that they felt they had no choice; that there was nothing else they could do in their situation. I think that when we have heard certain lies over and over, even if we knew they were lies when we heard them, but a situation comes up when that lie seems really convenient, it is all to easy to persuade ourselves to believe the lie. I have never been involved in an abortion, but I certainly have convinced myself that terrible things were actually OK at various moments in my life.

 

[workinprogressUK]

I told my wife about the counseling appointment and it didn?t go like I foresaw at all. She just got pissed and said it was typical me to make it all about me and only think about my needs. It?s almost like she?s pissed because I?m trying and she isn?t and it makes her look bad.
I think a separation may be in my future.

Congrats on staying clean and sane, when you must be pretty stressed-out. When I first went to counselling, my wife reacted similarly. From her perspective, I was off, with a shoulder to cry on, finding reasons to blame everybody other than myself (including her) for my many failings, while she was at home trying to hold everything together. Your situation is unique. Not the same. But I'm afraid she's unlikely to do cartwheels or build you a statue, just because we'd taken the first step. That said... You have taken the step! You are trying! Hang in there. Stay in the game. Do everything you can to avoid a separation, because she needs to see you consistently trying, being trustworthy and putting her first. We're all hoping for you.

 

[Pcpowder]

Wow Discolobus - What a rough couple of days, so sorry man! 

Congrats on staying clean!  It sounds like you have had a few breakthroughs, although tough ones.  Good for you getting in for a counselor so quickly.  Your wife reaction to you seeing a counselor seems way off to me.  I think any counseling is good and could only be a benefit for her, whether its just you or as a couple. 

It seems you are headed in a good direction, keep it up!

 

[workinprogressUK]

Congrats on still being clean. It's great that you're staying true to that and I hope you can hang tough. You must be good at creating a mind-muscle connection, so hopefully you can keep finding ways to control any cravings or gremlins.

Looks like things are going to stay really tough for you. I can tell how important your marriage is to you. I hope you can separate your recovery from P addiction from the recovery of your relationship though.

The bodybuilding advice from your counsellor is really interesting. I have every respect for the discipline and commitment you must put into achieving results. You may have read yourself that it's really easy to swap one process addiction for another. But at the same time it's super-healthy to exercise and have real-world interests that take us away from our screens. No surprise that it can be difficult to balance if you push it hard, like you clearly do. My own training has also become a bit obsessive, so I can empathise. I weigh a lot of my food, log my intake, count macros, track progressive overload and all that good stuff. It's easy to see how it becomes a new source of dopamine reliance and I've been tempted by performance enhancing juice, without ever taking the plunge. Within my own S addiction, it was disproportionately important for me to feel attractive to people, because i'd never managed to feel attractive in my own skin. So it worries me that a key plank of my recovery is essentially a narcissistic pursuit. Doesn't sound healthy, does it? I don't know specifically what your therapist is getting at by asking you to cut the BB, but it could be that something that encourages obsessive, compulsive behaviours and focuses on achieving cosmetic, physiological, perfection, just isn't such a healthy passtime for guys like us. Maybe you should switch to powerlifting and forget about definition and abs  .

You've really made me think, discobolus. Thank you for that. And good luck through the weekend. I hope your wife starts to soften her stance a little.

 

[workinprogressUK]

Hey Discobolus.

Congrats on staying away from P through this really difficult situation. Staying in the present and working through your challenges has to be the best way forward and its commendable that you've stayed with your commitments. You've even tried to address some of your wife's fears, which I hope she can feel reassured by. That lack of safety that your wife cites is the same fear that my wife cited when she threw me out a couple of years ago. My behaviours had shown me to be self-destructive and not safe to be around. It doesn't make me any less sad to read that you're going to move out, but I can at least reassure you that my relocation was only temporary. I sincerely hope that you continuing to demonstrate accountability, reliability and consideration will see you back in the family home, and on the road to a sustainable relationship, very soon.

I'm sure that I'm not alone in thinking real positive thoughts for you and your family. I wish you every strength. Don't give up the fight.

 

[Pcpowder]

ugg, my heart goes out to you man!  I'm glad to hear you are going back to body building as it sounds like that has been a passion of yours for along time and you need that in your life, especially right now! 

 

[Pcpowder]

I highly recommend getting a Vasectomy for sure, it has been one of the best decisions I ever made. 

The chances of a tragedy like you described are slim and even if it happened tomorrow would you really want to start a new family at this stage of your life?  By the time you grieved, found a new relationship would you want babies in your mid to late 40's?

this might come across as cold, but I have always been anti-kid for myself.  I actually went in for a vasectomy at 23 and started the vasectomy counseling they required at the time for guys under 30 without kids.  All my friends talked me out of having it at the time, saying I would change my mind and want kids...that never happened. 

I always had great anxiety about getting a girl pregnant and being trapped in a bad relationship because of it.  When I first started having ED problems I even thought that the fear of getting a girl pregnant was a contributing factor.  Both sides of my family have a long history of the doctor telling them they are in love.  Both sets of grandparents, my parents, and my sister all got pregnant before marriage and the marriages were all a disaster.  I was determined not to repeat the family history.  After my vasectomy, I definitely enjoyed sex more without having all the anxiety of "what if" she got pregnant. 

I finally had my vasectomy about 8 years ago, 2 years after I started to date my wife and she didn't want kids either, I was in my mid 30's and decided it was time and that I would not be changing my mind about having kids.  My wife loves it, no worry, no pills and no hormonal ups and downs related to taking birth control. 

I was petrified of the procedure, but it was no big deal.  I was laid out on the table with my pants down, heart pounding when the doctor told me it was about to be the worst part of the procedure and asked what I thought that was going to be.  I said "when you cut open by ball sack," he said "no, when I grab your dick and tape it to your stomach" and he did exactly that.

 

[Pcpowder]

HA! divorcing and being a man whore has crossed my mind more than once.  But you know that would make things worse.  As they say, the chief cause of failure is trading what you want most, for what you want at the moment. 

Good guess, yes I live in Park City.  I'm glad you had a good vacation here with the exception of the swim in the GSL.  I'm a big boater and I've lived here my entire life and have never touched the water in the GSL. 

The wind rivers are gorgeous!  What a great place to live as a kid!

When I read your post I did think the same thing that your wife might take it as too much all at once.  It might be something you do months down the road after you have your relationship heading in the right direction.  Is it something you can discuss with her and get on the same page? Do you think you would get an honest answer?

I had the same concerns about the risks of a vasectomy and did a lot of research prior to the procedure.  For me, at the end of the day, the small amount of risk was well worth the relief of knowing we couldn't be pregnant.  Even though I had the procedure after I started dating my wife, we did break up for about a year and I was a bit of a man-whore during that time.  The thought of if I hadn't had a vasectomy and got one of those escapades prego is horrifying. 

 

[workinprogressUK]

Sounds like really encouraging progress. congrats.