Lifting the fog...

[TodayIsTheDay]

Here is my two cents on the MO thing.  An occasional release is probably not a big deal, but be mindful of not letting it become a habit.  You've made 30 days so clearly you've made a ton of progress in terms of self control.  Hell, give it a try and see how you feel.  If it sets you back you know where you stand.  Another part of me says if you made 30, you should go for 60, but that could just be the ascetic in me talking.  Maybe think about it for another week before you decide.

 

[neon tiger]

Thank you red for embarking me on such a meaningful reflection, which i will post in my own thread below.

Todayistheday- the ascetic part of you didn't build as strong an argument as the other part (gentler, flexible, lighter?) 

I did think that I can go by the same rule i used last time- set up the goal based on what i have already accomplished. and if i was able to do 30, i should be able to do 30 more. So yes, i was leaning towards 60- and i am halfway there!

I will stay open to the give MO without porn or fantasy a try and see how i feel option, but i wont just jump on it because its 30 days and i 'deserve it'. That i can think about for another week or so...

This forum is my lifeline-  thank you all.

 

[neon tiger]

This is a post i wrote on another member's thread, but lead to some important realization about my own journey, so i am copying it here:

My first exposure to the 12 steps was through SAA, a couple years before my substance use became unmanageable and ended me in rehab. That was about 12 years ago (rehab will be 9 years ago this february). At the time, my acting out had escalated from PMO (which i had been doing since i was 14 years or so to VHS), to anonymous sex/hooking up. It was spiritual bankruptcy. After rehab, I have managed to stay drug and tobacco free for 7 1/2 years now.

With PMO on the other hand, I gave it up while in rehab because i had no options- no computer, no smart phone, semi privacy 24/7.

Holy shit- i just realized that i was PMO free for about 15 months!

I was in rehab as a client for 7 weeks, but then i joined their transitional living program for 13 months. I worked for them, and in return I received food, shelter, a stipend, and stayed focused on my continuing recovery. I just now realize that i wasn't recovering just from the substance use and abuse, but from my sex and porn addiction- by far the strongest one. I was connecting to others in a more genuine way; i felt less anxious, less sex minded; i was meditating, hiking, working out, thinking clearly. Yes, i was substance free, but more importantly, i was sex and porn free.

But i didn't see it that way and when i left rehab, and once i had access to technology and a little privacy, i knew exactly what i wanted.  I've been PMO'ing non stop since 2007, through a couple failed relationship attempts, graduate and post graduate studies, three years of psychotherapy, and glimpses of desperation and reaching out to SAA and SLAA, but not sticking to it because the meeting were too far. 

This is, as it is for you, my most difficult (and destructive) addition by a lot.  I have accomplished a lot professionally and personally in the last seven years, but my soul and spirit have never felt so devastated.  Sex and porn addiction is like one of those parasitic wasps that eat their host from the inside out while the host goes on about its business, until the wasps bursts out and leaves behind nothing but the hosts carcass.

 

[chiefmitch88]

Neon,

Congrats on 30 days! I hope you had a pleasant thanksgiving. It must be difficult during the holidays with your family so far away but it sounds like you are on the right track making social calls and lending support to your friends in need. It's great to see your progress! Looks like you are answering some important questions on this journey of self-discovery. Keep us abreast of any new revelations. It is great to have your viewpoint here on the forum.

 

[TodayIsTheDay]

Powerful story bro.  It's impressive how far you've come.  From low lows to a good life.  Nicely done.

 

[enoughisenough]

Congratulations NT. 30 days is a big deal. Your progress is an inspiration to me and others!

 

[neon tiger]

Thank you fellas.  Like i said, this forum is my lifeline.  I stand no chance without the support that comes from reading your stories and struggles, how you find the strength to carry on, and the sense of hope i get every time i read another one of you making it through another day free from this PMO wasp.

Chiefmitch: i got the book yesterday.  I met with a friend for a long due sushi fix (surf and turf roll- off the hook!), and there was a Barnes an Noble next to it.  Looking forward to go through the pages.

TodayIs: You're right, its been quite a turnover, and i should feel immensely accomplished. But again, PMO makes it all look like a big lie- like i am a big lie. I read this over and over on here. Successful careers, stable relationships. Thirty days in, i am starting to feel like my true self, my essence, can (and will) catch up with all the effort I've put in improving my life and live a genuine, integrated life.

Setting new goal to 60 now.  And i am 31 days in 

 

[neon tiger]

I stayed PMO free today.  Not much more to say.  Long day at work (i was very focused and driven though); not much time or energy to think about sex, and it didn't catch me off guard at any given time, like it has before. 

I am exhausted. Heading to bed

 

[neon tiger]

Im not having so much cravings but rather a longing for porn. I miss it. yesterday was pretty clear to me. Im missing companionship actually, but not having it, i found myself wishing i at least had porn to comfort me.  Well, it figures i guess. i saw the reg flag all over it fortunately. Turned lights off and went to bed. Im PMO free one more day...

 

[lyon03]

Hey brother! I've just read through your journal. Wow, you've been through a lot. Congratulations on reaching your goal and I look forward to sharing your progress to 60 and beyond. It's amazing but we've had very similar experiences, right down to stopping virtually the same day; the nighttime horniness; and attending a funeral during the first month. Anyhow, just reaching out to write that you're not alone in this journey. Stay strong. Porn is not an option! 

 

[neon tiger]

Thanks for spending some time on my journal. Hope it provided some sort of strength or at least kinship, as it seems, as it seems it did.  Im looking forward to browse through yor over the weekend when i have some time on my hands.

I woke up with a quite pleasant boner this morning!  I reached for it to get as sense of it- it felt really good. And i was very compelled to jerk it, (which is interesting because i have never been a morning PMO person- morning sex with a partner, yes, but never MO) I didn't though; It is not something I've agreed to allow as part of my recovery, but it did feel very right to do it.  This might be the answer to my question from a few days ago- allow if i have a god morning sod on a non work day, and not more than once every 15 days or so...  Any thoughts would be welcome.

And sound sleep seems to be back!  I haven't waken up in the middle of the night in a few days now.  That is a huge step; since i started my reboot, i was waking up at 2:30-3:00 and not falling asleep again. I am thrilled about that.  I also noticed i was doing a lot more emotional eating over the last 35 days or so, and i certainly put on a couple pounds.  Focusing now on get that on check and shed them back off.

Focus wise, i feel slightly scattered today.  Might go away once i step out the door (hopefully). It will also be a long day at work, but i would like to go for a short workout afterwards. Its a god day to practice kindness to self.

 

[neon tiger]

Awesome day at work. Completely on my game- focused, enthusiastic, assertive. I find myself realizing how all this is as result of my PMO recovery throughout the day, and telling myself "really dude, PMO is not worth giving up on this way of experiencing life.  And then this afternoon, after giving up on going to a concert i wanted to go tomorrow, a friend called to say she can go after all - yay!

Im craving an MO release. Not exactly horny, although i kind of am at times, but its not occupying too much of my awareness.  I feel at times like i am going through some sort of anorexia- kind of an indifference to sexual stimulation (is that the flatline?). But i do miss the physical sensation of M and O.  And then i feel like a little kid that don't get his toy. In which case, i must refer to my earlier thoughts in the day and come over here and journal.

Grateful for recovery and a rebooting brain. 

 

[johngalt75321]

Hi Neon,

It's sounds like you are crushing it! I'm jealous of all your days, but I will catch up!!! (Well, that's actually not possible unless you relapse, which would be bad...so never mind )

I've been reading through, and it's amazing how much progress you've made, especially given the eye issue and the move from home. That's tough, and it's so easy to self-medicate with porn.

For what it's worth (and granted, you've made it way longer than I have), I would avoid MO (even without porn). For me, I would start thinking about this in around the 2-3 week mark. And my brain would start rationalizing it (it's not porn, it's okay, it's a release so I don't use porn, I just want to 'test' my dick, etc). And then I would MO (with no porn, just like I had planned). But, then it makes your brain think it's in control again. It's like "see, the MO was great, why not PMO!"

Or, in other words, if I don't tell my brain to shut the fuck up about MO, then it's so much harder to ignore it when it wants PMO. It's not about whether MO is okay or not. It's about control, about saying "no", even if it's only to show your brain who is boss!

But this is just my take. I know others disagree. But personally, I don't think I could do MO without falling back into PMO (unless the MO was with a partner).

 

[neon tiger]

I value your feedback john.  Seems like you were around the amount of days i have now when you went AWOL a couple months back, so it is important to be mindful of what thew challenges are at this stage of the game.

That is what i have been leaning towards- no MO whatsoever.  I still fell it may be ok, but i feel there too much at stake to take a chance for not such a valid reason. And if i do decide to go that route, i want it to be a thorough, conscious, decision. It took me about four months of conversations with friends and my therapist between the moment i thought i was ready to have a drink socially to the moment i actually did- and it was a conscious decision, not just getting caught up in the moment. I think it will, and should be the same with MO.

Alright day here today. quiet morning, then workout, went shopping for christmas decorations and put them up.  Yesterday was awesome- ended up going to a concert i had not found anyone to go with me, but a friend had her plans cancelled due to rain and called to reconsider my previous offer.  It was a blast, and then we feasted on half price sushi and hours of good fun conversation. This is what i really am looking to recover- my sense of belonging, my ability to connect. The boners will follow, but for now I'm not feeling horny, and i am very ok with that (not that my PMO had anything to do with being horny really- most often i PMO'ed out of stress or anxiety, rather then horniness- and i am not feeling anxious either for that matter). 

 

[neon tiger]

Couple days since my last entry here.

Yesterday was kind of a blah day; i was under rested ,and didn't feel on the top of my game with work and else. Definitely a day when i had to remember to be kind to myself on a couple occasions. I also found myself realizing that this recovery will not endure if i just stay abstinent. I have to shift it into different gear, with my thinking and my actions; and i already have done some- but that, I'm afraid, will be an ongoing requirement of this process.

But today i got a major unexpected trigger- a very attractive hookup from a few years ago texted me today because he will be in the area in a few weeks, and wants to reconnect. The message was followed by a VERY provocative sexting shot. It had the same effect of porn. Dopamine flooded my brain like a tsunami while i sit in the parking lot at the gym. I responded to his messages, courteously, but kind of indifferently. I didn't encourage more pics, which i am sure i would've got more if i did.  But i didn't tell him to stop either. Fact is, we do have some unfinished business that doesn't have anything to do with acting out or sex, so i would like to see him, but it is quite unlikely that it wouldn't happen without us having sex. I believe that if the situation does arise, i will meet, and yes i will have sex, and it will be insanely hot- a relapse in any other circumstances, but it is important that we do meet, and i won't count it as a reset.  Until then (and if it do meet- we've tried on a few occasions before), i am resolved to stick to my rebooting process as currently defined.  With the help of all of you coming here and giving me strength and courage through your stories and experiences.

40 days today.  Feeling proud.

 

[lyon03]

Well done on reaching 40 days! With regards to hook up/sex while rebooting, that's a tough one. Perhaps, I'd reach out via message to some of the longer-term Rebooters for advice. While I continue to have sex with my long-term boyfriend, a welcome relief during my no PMO reboot, this is more of an intimate and loving connection for which our brains are wired. As such, I don't consider orgasm with a partner a relapse. I would however feel that going on a hookup site, exchanging photos, and having random sex a relapse. What you've described sounds like a bit between the two. The way you've described the build up to your encounter, the rush/images etc, it honestly sounds like a bit like a porn rush. I'd suggest writing down how you'll likely feel after you meet or how you've felt in the past. If you feel worse, guilty, and like this was a relapse, then don't do it because it would just be a human PMO encounter. If however you're safe, it feels like harmless fun, and is a welcome release, then why not? Regardless, keep posting. Stay strong brother. PORN IS NOT AN OPTION.

 

[neon tiger]

I agree with you Lyon that this situation blurs the line. Most likely, we won't meet because im in the Northeast and he is in the south (of USA). It looks like the days he will be in the area, i will be in Puerto Rico. Besides, we've attempted this encounter a few times and it has never worked out. But if the chance does arise,is important that we meet.  And if sex happens, i will probably allow it, since i didn't seek it, didn't go on hook up sites to make it happen.  it would definitely be a trigger though, and i will probably have to be super vigilant afterwards not to engage in porn or hook up sites.

But I'm putting this aside for now. Today i found myself more concerned with a lot of other things than this exchange with blast from the past. I was thinking of how porn has impaired my capacity to connect, and how disconnected i still feel after this amount of time rebooting.  I was wondering if i will ever be able develop a deep sense of connection, or am i already 'rotten' beyond repair. If i start to think the latter, then i begin to wonder what the point is anyway, and resort to porn, which is, well, the alternative- the familiar one too.

I want to believe that i am wrong on all these fears and assumptions, and that they are nothing but the product of my strong limbic brain yelling to claim control over me. And i want to believe that this brain's yelling will subside.

I am PMO free today. I am grateful for the promises that now seem possible, some days more than others.

 

[lyon03]

I can certainly relate and feel for you. I think we've all been in that dark place, wondering if we'll find love, deserve it, and round it goes. I was suicidal last December around this time. What a difference a year makes. Reboot/recovery are hard because the porn dulls our real feelings. Lift the fog (as you wrote) that is pornography and we see with dazzling clarity our broken lives. This left me with a choice: kill myself or face the music. I chose the latter and can write that I've never been happier than I am now. Life without addiction is prickly, painful, and full of emotions. But it can also be one full of truth, love, and unbelievable joy. It's the journey, not the destination and I know you'll get there. Stay strong brother. PORN IS NOT AN OPTION. 

 

[chiefmitch88]

Great words Lyon. Really struck a chord with me this morning. That "dazzling clarity" is a perfect way to describe it.

I know I am not one to give advice Tiger but I just wanted to put my two cents in regarding your meetup. Like Lyon said, I feel extremely vulnerable at this time because of the reality of my broken life. It is like I have no skin, nothing to protect me from the pain that the world and others might inflict on me. With that being said, I hope you have considered your expectations from this man and from this rendezvous. Your image of him might be clouded by the lens of your addict. Also, I know that at this point, I need to be VERY careful about the people I allow into my life. My legs are still  incredibly shaky and it wouldn't take much to rattle me to the point of crumbling.

Going in with the expectation that sex is imminent might cloud your judgement once more, and unless this man is on his own path of healing I would advise against it. If he is willingly posting unbidden sexts I would begin to question his motives for attention-grabbing behaviors. Perhaps he is battling an addiction of his own. When we start a relationship we invite each other into one another's "rabbit holes." Is that a neighborhood you feel you have the strength to go?

 

[readytobefree]

Wow this thread is really inspirational, so many guys with decent streaks going. Congrats on 40+ days @neon tiger!