Vomiting thoughts-Journey to Healing?

[Sammyjo]

Thanks Guys.

Don’t always look back on mistakes. We addicts can’t go back. We wish we could. Healing is an onwards exercise.

Ahhh...yes but no, in my humble opinion. I need to understand why I did what I did, and address the "why" so as to insure it NEVER happens again. Funny..."WHY" is the exact question I repeatedly ask of my husband which led to the escalation the other night, also funny, he doesn't seem to care about the why of my aggression and is ready to move past it. (Reminds me of the book Men are from Mars - perhaps worth a re-read)

Right now I have guesses, I've been scrolling through my history trying to find an article I read yesterday to be sure I am recalling it correctly (haven't been able to find it yet). From what I remember it had a list of things that if left unaddressed could escalate anger to aggression. The list had 8-12 items (guessing), things like feeling rejected, feeling unseen/unheard, fear (of him leaving me) - wish I could recall more. Bottom line is that the night I blew up I was feeling almost every item on the list.

My theory is I need to deal with these underlying feelings - find a way to make them go away rather than accept they are there and wait for them to diminish. Anyway, since I haven't been able to hook up with a therapist yet I figured I start the work myself.

Related to the subject, I found this VERY interesting:

Treatment for problem anger cannot merely reduce the emotional feelings or arousal of anger; it must restore a state of self-value that is more stable than whatever lowered it, which will replace the habit of blaming with a motivation to improve

(found here: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...-entitlement/201505/anger-management-failures )

So step 1 - restore self-value with something more stable than what lowered it. (Oh the irony!)

Guess I have found my thought to ponder for the day.

 

[Jlied]

also funny, he doesn't seem to care about the why of my aggression and is ready to move past it.

Hi @Sammy I would be willing to guess that he’s eager to move past it is because he still feels bad for the situation he has out you guys in. He might not feel he has a right to be angry at you right now or he just wants to keep the peace at home because it has been so uncomfortable as of late.

for me when my wife was really worked up I find I would become as calm as I can and let her work through her emotions. I didn’t fire back or get defensive. I wanted her to see I was committed to us and that I was willing to go through whatever I had to so that we could move forward.

I love that he came home and didn’t proceed to do anything other than talk with you and progress forward with you.

 

[Sammyjo]

Off on bunny trails today.

Woke up feeling hypervigilant (feel worried he's hiding crap, want to dig through his computer/phone). It starts off with my head feeling funny - like I am scared - really hard to describe, but there is an actual sensation in my head before I start feeling like I need to dig through his stuff.

This seems to happen in waves. Initially, and for a few months I felt this way all day, everyday. Now it is less frequent (maybe once a week, and seems nuts that 7 months out this is still happening). It's paralyzing. The feeling spreads through my whole body until I feel a bit shaky (that word looks like it needs an "e", shakey). Trying to figure out the trigger. Spoke to my husband about it this morning he had thoughts on it which I agreed with but the feeling is still there.

Did some research which led me to the term hypervigilance (I was using the word paranoia, there is a big difference in the psych world). Which led me on another search where I found the term "prodependent". I really like this term, it is kind of the opposite of codependent.
(from https://seekingintegrity.com/)

Prodependence vs. Codependence​

If you’re a betrayed partner, especially if your significant other is sex, porn, or substance addicted, you’ve probably had someone suggest that you read up on codependency and that you start attending Codependents Anonymous.

You will not hear those suggestions from Seeking Integrity. We are not fans of the codependency model. We feel that it is blaming and shaming toward you, holding you responsible for what happened when your only sin is loving a person who made some mistakes or is suffering from an addiction. Codependency would tell you to detach with love, to leave your partner, to let them sink or swim on their own. Codependency would tell you that you love too much, and it’s hurting both you and your partner.

We think that’s a load of you-know-what. We think it’s not possible to love too much. We think it’s crazy to suggest to you that you walk away from a loved one when they’re struggling and finally trying to do something about it.

But what’s the alternative, you ask? Well, we have an answer, courtesy of Dr. Robert Weiss, and that answer is prodependence.

I never liked the term codependent as there is such a negative connotation to it. - isn't that the entire basis of marriage? You swear to love honor and protect each other. You are SUPPOSED to be there for each other. Codependency infers you rely (in a negative way) on someone else. So I'm really diggin' this new word "Prodependent"!

Gonna leave the bunny trails there before I end up down the rabbit hole.

G'day all!

 

[Sammyjo]

HA! FOUND A COUNSELOR!

As I mentioned early on, I used to go to counseling because I was so insecure in our marriage and he said it was my problem (hind sight). Anyway, the first person I looked up was my previous counselor but it said she wasn't taking on new patients (I haven't seen her in over 2 years). I don't know why it took me so long to think of this, but out of desperation, I emailed her this morning, explained the situation and asked if she could possibly fit me in. She replied almost immediately with a yes!

 

[Blondie]

This is great, happy for you @Sammyjo.

I like that Prodependent idea as well.

 

[Gracie]

Yay! Sammy Jo!

 

[ImBroken]

Good things happen to good people. Really happy for you.

 

[Beautiful1973]

Woke up feeling hypervigilant (feel worried he's hiding crap, want to dig through his computer/phone). It starts off with my head feeling funny - like I am scared - really hard to describe, but there is an actual sensation in my head before I start feeling like I need to dig through his stuff.

My Sex Therapist calls this ‘Porn Police’, the compulsion to want to check facts, double check, dig…… the feeling of hyper vigilance drives you insane.

@Sammyjo has your hubby had any slips/relapse since disclosure/discovery?

 

[Sammyjo]

My Sex Therapist calls this ‘Porn Police’, the compulsion to want to check facts, double check, dig…… the feeling of hyper vigilance drives you insane.

@Sammyjo has your hubby had any slips/relapse since disclosure/discovery?

Not that I have found and when I ask he says no. A lot of behaviors support this, but there things on the physical side that make me question it. (Not just the off and on ED).

Curious, what does your therapist say about hyper vigilance?

 

[Beautiful1973]

@Sammyjo the Sex Therapist believed it was a total waste of energy and that I had no control over his actions and that I should just focus on my own life/activities......but we all know it's not that black & white when you've been betrayed, and I couldn't accept that.
Whereas the Betrayal Trauma Therapist I have been seeing for 3 months and also see's my man for the Porn Addiction, validated my feelings around the hyper-vigilance, she thinks it's a normal responses, and was the one that helped me set boundaries, once he finally admitted he had a problem with Porn.

I just wonder if you might still be having a hard time feeling emotionally safe, because you find it hard to believe that he hasn't had a slip, not to say that he has, and I think it's wonderful that he's done so well with his sobriety......but we know they lied to us before, so I know personally it's a constant battle to trust that they won't lie to me again.....it takes a lot of work and emotional energy. Then on top of that we have to deal with the emotional neglect we felt, the lack of interest in us, the ED, the knock to our self esteem........and I think we can feel a lot of anger and resentment regarding the damage to 'self', and I bet if you start to go under your anger, you might be surprised at what you find.

One thing I do try not to focus on too much on is the 'why'........I am a beautiful sexy woman, my man could have sex on tap (sorry to be blunt), I was kind and loving, fun to be with......but it's not about me or you......it's about him/them......it's not even about sex......it's about soothing, coping, avoiding, distraction.......and until they workout their triggers, their trauma, they won't be able to tell us or themselves the why.

I hope this doesn't stir up too much emotion in you, I know you've had a tough week, but I think going back and talking to your Therapist is going to be really beneficial for your healing.

 

[Sammyjo]

Looking for thoughts on this -

Last night we were going to BJ's (for those not familiar it's wholesale club which requires a membership card). I was having trouble finding the card and my husband said "do you just want to use mine?" (he never previously had one). So I asked "when did you get a BJ's card", he said he signed up a few weeks ago. I asked why he got one and why he didn't tell me. The conversation went on for a minute or so and he said "I'm lying, I just wanted to see if you would believe me."

I didn't pursue the conversation further, but it's been weighing on me...Who in their right mind would test out a lie on their spouse that they have recently F'd up by lying? Part of me is saying this is no big deal, leave it alone, the other part is pecking at my brain saying "WTF?".

Trying not to overreact.

Thoughts?

 

[Blondie]

I'm not going to lie, that's a little strange @Sammyjo. Maybe he just has a different sense of humor than I do, but I can tell you this, after I had lied to my girl for a year, making a joke about her "believing" me again would not have been a part of my repertoire. Maybe I'm missing the context here, but it does seem a little off.

Could it be a passive aggressive move, where he's hurt that you're still having "trust issues" so he's making a roundabout "joke" about it?? That's a possibility.

It's definitely something I would not have done, but like I said, perhaps I'm missing the context.

 

[Sammyjo]

I'm not going to lie, that's a little strange @Sammyjo. Maybe he just has a different sense of humor than I do, but I can tell you this, after I had lied to my girl for a year, making a joke about her "believing" me again would not have been a part of my repertoire. Maybe I'm missing the context here, but it does seem a little off.

Could it be a passive aggressive move, where he's hurt that you're still having "trust issues" so he's making a roundabout "joke" about it?? That's a possibility.

It's definitely something I would not have done, but like I said, perhaps I'm missing the context.

I don't think you're missing the context, and it's possible he's being passive aggressive.

Trying to figure out the right words to approach the topic. The words that keep coming to mind are "Do you think it was productive to "test" out a lie on me when we're trying to re-establish trust?" But I feel like there must be a better/more productive way to word this.

I definitely need to speak to him about it because it's stupid stuff like this that if I don't address it, just try to put it out of my mind, will come out in a bad way in the heat of some other discussion.

 

[Blondie]

Interesting @Sammyjo.

You could always say something like, "When you "lied" to me this morning, it made me feel like I couldn't trust you again (taking ownership of your feelings) What did you mean by saying 'I just wanted to see if you would believe me?'"

Then just be silent and see what he says. This way you're not actually judging or accusing him (which might make him react to defend himself) and you're also taking ownership of your feelings.

Either way you go about it, even asking him in a "wrong" way would be better than not saying anything all. As you said, this needs to be addressed.

Good luck!

 

[Beautiful1973]

@Sammyjo I’ve been told to use ‘I’ statements, similar to what @Blondie is referencing.
‘I’ felt really hurt and confused by your comment about believing you last night, what did you mean by that?

 

[Sammyjo]

@Blondie Thank you! That is perfect!

I sure hope you're studying to be a therapist!

Sometimes my head just gets spinning with if I say this, then that will happen...can't get out of my own way sometimes

 

[Blondie]

can't get out of my own way sometimes

I hear ya, same here!

 

[Beautiful1973]

Follow up response:

‘I’ didn’t appreciate being tested when my trust is already fragile.

 

[Jlied]

@Sammyjo i think making a joke about you believing him is a bit tone def all things considered. Now I will play devils advocate here….what if he was trying to make a sexual innuendo? Plenty of people make jokes about BJ’s. What if he was saying he signed up for a BJ’s membership as a sexual innuendo to you to see if you would make a joke back about it or maybe you would say something about your stance on BJ’s sexually. But, maybe because you didn’t take the joke in that manner he got embarrassed or awkward and wanted to just end the conversation and that response was something that came out of awkwardness?

Otherwise I agree it’s not a good time to lie, regardless of how innocent just to see if your wife would believe you.

 

[Sammyjo]

Hi Friends,

Thank you all for your input! It seems so silly that I needed advice on how to word something like that, but like I said, I couldn't get out of my own way. I really appreciate all your thoughts!

I took @Blondie's advice and used his words. (They really were perfect.) My husband said he way "just joking around" and immediately realized that wasn't appropriate under our current circumstances. Now I can let it go and not fester.

On a side note, we had date night and it finally went well. Maybe we can have an ENTIRE good weekend